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    x51 Powerkit on a Carrera S?

    Hello guys,

    I am currently contemplating whether the x51 Power Kit would be a worthwhile investment to add to my tiptronic 997S. It goes for $16.5k here for an OEM job. I have a few questions though;

    1. How noticable is the difference between a standard 997S and an x51 997S, in terms of straight line acceleration and engine response? Is it really noticable/significant, or is it just a little nudge of power more at every shift?

    2. I know the power is bumped to 381 bhp, but what about the torque? The standard 997S comes with 400 nm of torque, is that increased at all?

    3. The Sport Exhaust system will be fitted with the Power Kit as I understand, but if I had the PSE already fitted and then installed the x51, would I notice a difference in the engine sound?

    4. How does it compare to the other power kits available, like the one from Gemballa (+55 hp?) / RUF / Hamann (45 hp and 50 tq)? Ive heard the PSE sounds better than most other tuners exhaust systems, any comments on that?

    5. When is the recommended time to have the x51 installed? Currently my car has done 5k km's (not planning on changing anything until I hit 10k and get the first check done at least). Also, will the modified engine have to be 'broken in' again in any way?

    Any other technical information about the x51 or any experiences with it would be greatly appreciated. Sorry if this has all been discussed before, ive used the search and couldnt find anything on it here.

    Thanks chaps!

    Re: x51 Powerkit on a Carrera S?

    Hi Flagg, I was driving an x51 recently. Unfortunatley it was an 4 runner as my CS is an 2 wheeler. The major difference I felt was on higher revs, where the X51 was even more aggressiv as the x51 already is. But as I said in beginning, as I compared an 4 against a 2WD the difference wasn't that strong as I wanted it to have. So - I wouldnt invest that money out of that experience as most of time I shift between 5.000 and 6.000 and thats the area you feel the x51.

    One more thing - the consumption was around 17,8 ltr on the testdrive, I had the feeling it is 2 ltr/100km higher than the normal S. But as you are from Dubai, this doesnt count for you at all

    Re: x51 Powerkit on a Carrera S?

    I have X51 on my club coupe now. I had a 997S prior to this club coupe so I can give you a comparison.

    For regular city driving, I do not notice any difference at all as the 997S (or even 997) is fast enough.

    On highway or track use, I felt that the X51 gives a slightly faster and linear acceleration especially around 4000 to 6000 rpm on 2nd, 3rd and 4th gears.

    I will not spend $16.5K on this small power difference after driving both cars. But if I can buy a pre-owned car that comes with X51 then I certainly will go for it.

    Re: x51 Powerkit on a Carrera S?

    Thanks for the input guys! Hope to get some more input too, and responses to some of the questions as well if possible!

    Re: x51 Powerkit on a Carrera S?

    Quote:
    Flagg said:

    2. I know the power is bumped to 381 bhp, but what about the torque? The standard 997S comes with 400 nm of torque, is that increased at all?



    Torque reaches 415 Nm @ 5500 rpm and what is more important torque is continuously staying above 997S without X51 level. See graph below.

    Quote:
    Flagg said:
    3. The Sport Exhaust system will be fitted with the Power Kit as I understand, but if I had the PSE already fitted and then installed the x51, would I notice a difference in the engine sound?



    According to German registration documents it is louder.
    Standing noise C2S + X51: 102 dB
    Standing noise C2S + PSE: 99 dB
    BUT same documents for C2S without PSE say
    Standing noise C2S: 99 dB
    For comparison: 996 C4S + PSE: standing noise 108 dB

    Re: x51 Powerkit on a Carrera S?

    I wouldn't spend the money. I looked into adding it to a 996 model I owned in the past. I then ordered it on my current 997. Don't get me wrong it is a great all around car but definately not a night and day difference to an S or even a base model.

    I rode in a 997 GT3 last night and that you could feel for sure.

    Re: x51 Powerkit on a Carrera S?

    Better off with aftermarket upgrades, or upgrade to a more powerful model.

    Re: x51 Powerkit on a Carrera S?

    It's a shame that Porsche doesn't come out with a real "power kit" for the money they charge for X51. For US$16K it should bump the hp and tq by at least 40 each and make a noticeable difference in the lower rev range, where 911s are lacking. I would reckon that everyone on this board who owns any version of a NA 911 is regularly bummed out when they hit the gas in third gear at 2000 RPM.

    Re: x51 Powerkit on a Carrera S?

    Quote:
    U Boat Commander said:
    It's a shame that Porsche doesn't come out with a real "power kit" for the money they charge for X51. For US$16K it should bump the hp and tq by at least 40 each and make a noticeable difference in the lower rev range, where 911s are lacking. I would reckon that everyone on this board who owns any version of a NA 911 is regularly bummed out when they hit the gas in third gear at 2000 RPM.



    That situation is so that people still aspire to own a Turbo.

    I agree, the powerkit is a joke.

    Re: x51 Powerkit on a Carrera S?

    Thanks for the input fellas!

    That is dissapointing though, I really was hoping to bump my cars performance without losing the 2 year warranty, but as I was expecting the power kit isnt nearly worth its money, and the performance increases are negligible.

    I might look into Gemballa's Power Kit, apparently its a bit punchier and sounds nicer too, & its also an OEM job here. Although the international warranty would drop if I went for it, a 2 year local warranty can be purchased after the upgrades. But that opens up a whole new game with reliability issues with non-porsche engine upgrades..

    Ill see how it goes and keep you updated

    Re: x51 Powerkit on a Carrera S?

    I think that the X51 is a typically thorough job and apart from the breathing improvements they also fit the third radiator to manuals which is standard on the tiptronics. Unless you spend lots of time beyond 5000 rpm I'm not sure it's worth the difference.

    FWIW I am thinking about having it fitted to my 2007 C2S but that decision really depends on what the facelift brings. If the facelift really has an extra 25 hp and more torque then it might be better to trade the current onein next year when the residuals have recovered a bit on the current version. On the other hand if they go for a cleaner engine with only 10-15 hp more I'll probably do it and keep my car becuase I have to say that beyond 5000 rpm it really does make a difference back to back with a normal C2S, from my ride in one.

    Re: x51 Powerkit on a Carrera S?

    The X51 cars are deceivingly fast and do have gobs of torque down low. Its just not a put you back in the seat type hit when the car is in the powerband.

    Re: x51 Powerkit on a Carrera S?

    Not to mention that porsche actually understates the 'real' increase in power. I remember reading on these forums that in independent dyno tests they were consistently achieving about 400bhp.....I had my X51 put in and enjoy it very much.....there is a noticeable difference in low end torque and frankly being a city driver that is where I spend most of my time....

    Re: x51 Powerkit on a Carrera S?

    Quote:
    Nad said:
    Not to mention that porsche actually understates the 'real' increase in power. I remember reading on these forums that in independent dyno tests they were consistently achieving about 400bhp.....I had my X51 put in and enjoy it very much.....there is a noticeable difference in low end torque and frankly being a city driver that is where I spend most of my time....



    Hmm, interesting. How far ahead of a non-x51 997S do you reckon youd be from 0-150'ish km/h?

    Re: x51 Powerkit on a Carrera S?

    Thats a tough question as I have never raced one....but the increase in power is linear across the whole rpm band so I would assume that across your '0-150'ish km/h' the X51 car should steadily pull away especially as you hit the higher rev's (dont forget the X51's rev higher than regular stock cars). You will definitely feel the car being more punchy in the lower revs. The best way I know to describe the difference is that it is similar to the difference you currently feel between regular mode and sport mode....so it is like having a sport mode and a sport+ mode instead...I hope that makes sense. At the end of the day its all about personal choice and priority...if you have the cash to splash and you want to go for an upgrade it is worth considering the X51 if for nothing else it preserves the warranty which was a major deciding factor for me. I have no regrets......

    Ps. If you do go for it I strongly reccommend the short shifter as well.....doesnt cost very much and well worth it.

    Re: x51 Powerkit on a Carrera S?

    Cool thanks for that :P

    Also im driving a tip so short shifter isnt needed.

    What is the redline bumped up to btw?

    Re: x51 Powerkit on a Carrera S?

    From memory you get about an extra 250/300 rpm...so 7450/7500....

    Re: x51 Powerkit on a Carrera S?

    Have a read on this link.....it talks about the X51 in a bit more detail....

    http://www.porscheclubgbforum.com/tm.asp?m=353055&mpage=1&key=&#353545

    Re: x51 Powerkit on a Carrera S?

    This should be helpful.


    Here's the major blurb on X51 from Excellence Magazine:

    Enjoy

    With the fluids properly warmed and a long onramp just ahead, it's time to put the X51 engine through its paces. In second gear and at full throttle, acceleration is strong - but then the same can be said for any Carrera S and even the 3.6-liter Carrera. The latest 3.8-liter 997s are powerful enough leave one wondering if there's much development potential left in the normally-aspirated flat six.

    X51 answers that question convincingly, with a 997 Carrera S-like powerband that's as linear as it is strong. It offers good torque from just off idle all the way up to redline, but it can't match the GT3's top-end fervor. It feels slightly more "workhorse" to the high-strung GT3's thoroughbred. But, in a 911 more likely to be used every day than most GT3s will be, that's a good thing. The X51 3.8 offers tractable power everywhere, with plenty of good noises and enough zing to keep things interesting as it reaches for redline.

    Does it feel faster than a plain Carrera S? Yes and no. No because it's tough to feel a seven percent power increase in a car that weighs more than 3,000 pounds and claims more than 350 horsepower. But informal roll-on tests in third and fourth gears later in the day saw the Club Coupe pull away from the 2005 997S slowly, but surely. It was exactly the difference you'd expect from a 26 hp/11 lb-ft advantage. Importantly, X51 gives up nothing across its powerband to the regular 3.8. Though its peak power and torque figures come 600 and 900 rpm later, the X51's powerband never dips below the 3.8's. Even from 1500-2000 rpm, it has a useful, 15 lb-ft advantage.

    People after the best horsepower-per-dollar equation might be happier spending their $17,000 on the aftermarket, but X51 has two edges that must be considered: (1) it maintains the factory's full warranty and (2) there's a sweetness to this engine that can't be quantified. The throttle response in the X51-equipped 2006 997S was plain superior to the 2005 997S we tried. The revised motor sings through its powerband with an alacrity one wouldn't know the standard engine is missing - unless he or she tried an X51. Gear after gear, pull after pull to its 7300-rpm redline, the X51 engine is considerably more satisfying than the normal 3.8 - which itself is no slouch.

    Re: x51 Powerkit on a Carrera S?

    Quote:
    Moogle said:
    Quote:
    U Boat Commander said:
    It's a shame that Porsche doesn't come out with a real "power kit" for the money they charge for X51. For US$16K it should bump the hp and tq by at least 40 each and make a noticeable difference in the lower rev range, where 911s are lacking. I would reckon that everyone on this board who owns any version of a NA 911 is regularly bummed out when they hit the gas in third gear at 2000 RPM.



    That situation is so that people still aspire to own a Turbo.

    I agree, the powerkit is a joke.




    Test drove 997.

    Test drove and bought a 997S.

    No perceptible difference (but didn't test drive on a track).

    Can't imagine X51 will be that much different from your stock S.

    Then, one day I started to notice I was "waiting" for my 997S to accelerate and so immediately traded it in for a Turbo.

    Conclusion 100+ HP makes an obvious difference. Is it worth the extra us$40K? Yes. There can be no doubt.

    Funny that us$15K gets you 20 more hp and us$40K gets you 120hp more; looks like buying HP in "bulk" is a better deal.

    Relax and enjoy the car the way it is for now; trade it in when it "makes sense" for you to do so (or when you crack because you can't stand it anymore).

    Re: x51 Powerkit on a Carrera S?

    I added the Powerkit as a retrofit on my 2006 Carrera S. I had an MSRP of $106k+ on the car prior to the X51 retrofit which, after its installation, bumped my total price to over $122k!!! Two years since that and with 15k miles on the odometer, my car would bring in as a trade around $65-70k!!! I'd have to agree with MMD, keep the car as is and, when you cannot stand it anymore and crack, put the $15k+ on top of whatever you get for your 997S and get the Turbo!

    Re: x51 Powerkit on a Carrera S?

    Hey Cybergypsy, you seem to be cheerful about it. It's an investment in fun and an occasional PITA too. I can't think of a more interesting way to blow _some_ money. If you're married it's better than having a girlfriend (so I hear )


    For aesthetic, stylistic stuff I say, "Just because Porsche offers it as an option doesn't mean it looks good."

    Now we can add, "Just because Porsche offers it as an option [X51] doesn't mean it makes sense."


    Re: x51 Powerkit on a Carrera S?

    MMD, I am married and can tell you that the girlfriends not only are an interesting way to blow money but also a potentially catastrophic situation because ALL of them, no matter how much BS they say at the beginning, want to get you for themselves until they find the next man that they perceive to have more money, so they can move up the ladder. At least with the car, it only amounts to blowing money and you can turn it off and not hear about "her" until you want to! Try that with a female! LOL!

    Re: x51 Powerkit on a Carrera S?

    I hear ya, Oh yeah! Correct about the money, BS _and_ that's an extremely accurate use of the phrase "potentially catastrophic." LOL.


     
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