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    Any word on how well 997 sales are going in the USA?

    My sales guy just called me and offered me a build date.

    Re: Any word on how well 997 sales are going in the USA?

    What date was it?
    My dealer said that they had already sold all their 2005 allocation.

    Re: Any word on how well 997 sales are going in the USA?

    Quote:
    DD694 said:
    What date was it?
    My dealer said that they had already sold all their 2005 allocation.



    These car are beginning to be discounted. See P. 40 of the current Autoweek. A dealer is offering $2500 discounts on 05 coupes. I have also heard of other instances of discounting.

    The car is not being that well received by the buying public despite the positive press.

    Re: Any word on how well 997 sales are going in the USA?

    In fact one of the Houston dealerships still has the Carrera (not S) that they had for the launch event. The sales guy said they had a lot of orders for the "S" model but nothing happening on the regular Carrera models.

    Re: Any word on how well 997 sales are going in the USA?

    Quote:
    nberry said:
    These car are beginning to be discounted. See P. 40 of the current Autoweek. A dealer is offering $2500 discounts on 05 coupes. I have also heard of other instances of discounting.

    The car is not being that well received by the buying public despite the positive press.



    Discounts? I know of one dealer who is selling a used one for $5K over list because he has no inventory. Another one has new ones offering at $5K over list. Most dealers have very little inventory, plus the fact that all the cars sold so far have been the ones made before the factory closure. No dealers have received any cars made after the summer break at least on the west coast. And then there are the build slots available, most are now somewhere into 2005.

    Re: Any word on how well 997 sales are going in the USA?

    Quote:
    vtrader said:
    Quote:
    nberry said:
    These car are beginning to be discounted. See P. 40 of the current Autoweek. A dealer is offering $2500 discounts on 05 coupes. I have also heard of other instances of discounting.

    The car is not being that well received by the buying public despite the positive press.



    Discounts? I know of one dealer who is selling a used one for $5K over list because he has no inventory. Another one has new ones offering at $5K over list. Most dealers have very little inventory, plus the fact that all the cars sold so far have been the ones made before the factory closure. No dealers have received any cars made after the summer break at least on the west coast. And then there are the build slots available, most are now somewhere into 2005.



    Common we all know what agenda Nick has

    Re: Any word on how well 997 sales are going in the USA?

    Quote:
    vtrader said:
    Quote:
    nberry said:
    These car are beginning to be discounted. See P. 40 of the current Autoweek. A dealer is offering $2500 discounts on 05 coupes. I have also heard of other instances of discounting.

    The car is not being that well received by the buying public despite the positive press.



    Discounts? I know of one dealer who is selling a used one for $5K over list because he has no inventory. Another one has new ones offering at $5K over list. Most dealers have very little inventory, plus the fact that all the cars sold so far have been the ones made before the factory closure. No dealers have received any cars made after the summer break at least on the west coast. And then there are the build slots available, most are now somewhere into 2005. [/quot

    I suspect LA and SF can be very different mkts than those of many of these dealers that advertise in Autoweek, etc...gotta remember there are P dealers in all kinds of economically weak smaller cities in the middle of nowhere where P's are hard to sell in general...let alone post-summer...

    Re: Any word on how well 997 sales are going in the USA?

    Quote:
    VKSF said:
    I suspect LA and SF can be very different mkts than those of many of these dealers that advertise in Autoweek, etc...gotta remember there are P dealers in all kinds of economically weak smaller cities in the middle of nowhere where P's are hard to sell in general...let alone post-summer...



    It would also be interesting to know how many of the discounted cars are the "non-S" version.

    Re: Any word on how well 997 sales are going in the USA?

    Quote:
    lev said:



    Common we all know what agenda Nick has



    Your right I do have an agenda. In the most recent year report Porsche boasted over 1 BILLION euro profit. This is from a small car company. Now how do you suppose they were able to that?

    The answer; Porsche is the most expensive sport car on the planet. How can I make that statement? If you factor in resale value ( a point made by another poster) the car relative to other sport cars is more expensive. The car drops like a rock once of the show room floor and for good reason. It is overproduced, overpriced and not special.

    Look at the poor CGT. It is their top of the line model and within 6 months an owner will be lucky to get MSRP for it. Porsche will make money but the customer is going to take a huge loss.

    We are lining Porsche pockets while our complaints about several service issues Porsche ignores. The 997 is facing a dim future unless Porsche limits production which would be like asking Fritz to utter one complaint against his beloved Porsche. It will not happen.

    Re: Any word on how well 997 sales are going in the USA?

    Quote:
    nberry said:
    Quote:
    lev said:



    Common we all know what agenda Nick has



    Your right I do have an agenda. In the most recent year report Porsche boasted over 1 BILLION euro profit. This is from a small car company. Now how do you suppose they were able to that?

    The answer; Porsche is the most expensive sport car on the planet. How can I make that statement? If you factor in resale value ( a point made by another poster) the car relative to other sport cars is more expensive. The car drops like a rock once of the show room floor and for good reason. It is overproduced, overpriced and not special.

    Look at the poor CGT. It is their top of the line model and within 6 months an owner will be lucky to get MSRP for it. Porsche will make money but the customer is going to take a huge loss.

    We are lining Porsche pockets while our complaints about several service issues Porsche ignores. The 997 is facing a dim future unless Porsche limits production which would be like asking Fritz to utter one complaint against his beloved Porsche. It will not happen.



    Resale value is a complex argument which depends on specific model, lease terms, duration of ownership, mileage, etc. etc. End of the day, I would argue big boys, i.e. true members of the "exclusive" club , pick out car they enjoy driving, knowing any car is rarely an investment but rather a recreational expense they can afford. F 360 and Enzo have solid resale value, but 575 is fairly weak on resale....but guys who pull out their checkbook for a 575 typically are smart enough to know about its weak resale but nevertheless want the toy.....what does an hour of NetJets flight time cost again?

    Re: Any word on how well 997 sales are going in the USA?

    Quote:
    nberry said:
    Quote:
    lev said:



    The car drops like a rock once of the show room floor and for good reason. It is overproduced, overpriced and not special.

    Look at the poor CGT. It is their top of the line model and within 6 months an owner will be lucky to get MSRP for it. Porsche will make money but the customer is going to take a huge loss.



    Ok gang, my 997S will be here in 3 weeks or so. I didn't realize that depreciation was so steep on the 911. I plan to buy the 997 C4S about a year after it is released -- am i going to take a huge bath on the 997S?

    Re: Any word on how well 997 sales are going in the USA?

    Quote:
    nberry said:
    Quote:
    lev said:



    Common we all know what agenda Nick has



    Your right I do have an agenda. In the most recent year report Porsche boasted over 1 BILLION euro profit. This is from a small car company. Now how do you suppose they were able to that?

    The answer; Porsche is the most expensive sport car on the planet. How can I make that statement? If you factor in resale value ( a point made by another poster) the car relative to other sport cars is more expensive. The car drops like a rock once of the show room floor and for good reason. It is overproduced, overpriced and not special.

    Look at the poor CGT. It is their top of the line model and within 6 months an owner will be lucky to get MSRP for it. Porsche will make money but the customer is going to take a huge loss.

    We are lining Porsche pockets while our complaints about several service issues Porsche ignores. The 997 is facing a dim future unless Porsche limits production which would be like asking Fritz to utter one complaint against his beloved Porsche. It will not happen.


    nick,is anybody asking you how much money you are making and how?as far as i know ,whatever amount of profit porsche is earning,it has earned it legally,they did not stole it from anybody,i cant remember a case when dr.wiedeking has put a gun in a customers head to buy his cars ,and believe me 99% of the people that bought a porsche are happy and asking for it again and again.personnaly i am very happy that porsche is making that much profit because they will have enough $ to make devellopment of another great car like the 997, that perform like a modena at half the price with a better built quality and knowledge of some luxury options,not to talk about ferrari's cluncky sequential gearbox that will need to take a few years of lessons from bmw smg.
    so to cut things short ,i,and every analyst,banker ,expert or whoever you choose ,can tell you few things that may relief you from your endless quest of porsche scrap talk:porsche will continue to sell all its production of all their range,with the same amount of profits.porsche will not bankrupt soon ,and surely not from your kind of talk,if you think you are convincing anybody,you are wrong,people are laughing at your poseur points of views.porsche will continue (thanks god) to ignore your complaints because luckily they can make a difference when somebody is talking for a real issue or just to play the snob and ask for less cars. and to finish,just to satisfy my curiosity,if you are soooo mad at porsche and sooooo happy with your ferrari ,why are you waisting your time on this and every forum on the planet with the same talk over and over,its solved ,just forget that something called porsche exists,put a pic of montezemolo over your bed ,take a nap and destress yourself

    Re: Any word on how well 997 sales are going in the USA?

    Quote:
    GG said:
    Quote:
    nberry said:
    Quote:
    lev said:



    The car drops like a rock once of the show room floor and for good reason. It is overproduced, overpriced and not special.

    Look at the poor CGT. It is their top of the line model and within 6 months an owner will be lucky to get MSRP for it. Porsche will make money but the customer is going to take a huge loss.



    Ok gang, my 997S will be here in 3 weeks or so. I didn't realize that depreciation was so steep on the 911. I plan to buy the 997 C4S about a year after it is released -- am i going to take a huge bath on the 997S?



    Sounds like you'll keep 997S for 2 yrs or so. I doubt anyone can accurately predict 997S resale value 2 yrs from now. May want to look into 24 or 30 month lease to try to "lock-in" operating costs and eliminate the resale value unknown.

    Re: Any word on how well 997 sales are going in the USA?

    Quote:
    dhayek said:
    Quote:
    nberry said:
    Quote:
    lev said:



    Common we all know what agenda Nick has



    Your right I do have an agenda. In the most recent year report Porsche boasted over 1 BILLION euro profit. This is from a small car company. Now how do you suppose they were able to that?

    The answer; Porsche is the most expensive sport car on the planet. How can I make that statement? If you factor in resale value ( a point made by another poster) the car relative to other sport cars is more expensive. The car drops like a rock once of the show room floor and for good reason. It is overproduced, overpriced and not special.

    Look at the poor CGT. It is their top of the line model and within 6 months an owner will be lucky to get MSRP for it. Porsche will make money but the customer is going to take a huge loss.

    We are lining Porsche pockets while our complaints about several service issues Porsche ignores. The 997 is facing a dim future unless Porsche limits production which would be like asking Fritz to utter one complaint against his beloved Porsche. It will not happen.


    nick,is anybody asking you how much money you are making and how?as far as i know ,whatever amount of profit porsche is earning,it has earned it legally,they did not stole it from anybody,i cant remember a case when dr.wiedeking has put a gun in a customers head to buy his cars ,and believe me 99% of the people that bought a porsche are happy and asking for it again and again.personnaly i am very happy that porsche is making that much profit because they will have enough $ to make devellopment of another great car like the 997, that perform like a modena at half the price with a better built quality and knowledge of some luxury options,not to talk about ferrari's cluncky sequential gearbox that will need to take a few years of lessons from bmw smg.
    so to cut things short ,i,and every analyst,banker ,expert or whoever you choose ,can tell you few things that may relief you from your endless quest of porsche scrap talk:porsche will continue to sell all its production of all their range,with the same amount of profits.porsche will not bankrupt soon ,and surely not from your kind of talk,if you think you are convincing anybody,you are wrong,people are laughing at your poseur points of views.porsche will continue (thanks god) to ignore your complaints because luckily they can make a difference when somebody is talking for a real issue or just to play the snob and ask for less cars. and to finish,just to satisfy my curiosity,if you are soooo mad at porsche and sooooo happy with your ferrari ,why are you waisting your time on this and every forum on the planet with the same talk over and over,its solved ,just forget that something called porsche exists,put a pic of montezemolo over your bed ,take a nap and destress yourself



    Well said, dhayek. It's not clear to me who in the automotive world is producing more interesting driver's cars per operating cost dollar than P. I suspect an analysis of 2-3 yr, 12K mi/yr ownership costs of GT3 or 997S would show these cars are fairly priced vs any comparables available. For 360, one would prob have to add in costs for fact that 95%+ of owners need to own another daily driver because of negative connotations of F-car commuting for guys in many businesses....also add in 360's higher maintenance costs (and lower resale in context of a 360 w/12K mi/yr) and this supposed resale value advantage is easily trumped....

    Re: Any word on how well 997 sales are going in the USA?

    Nick,

    It sounds that nothing can satisfy you...I still hope your spider does :-)

    I wonder what you would be telling if Porsche was losing money? I bet something along those lines - "still being the most expensive car on the planet Porsche cant make profits from selling its cars, the company will not survive etc. etc."

    As for "poor" CGT and its "depreciation" I already told you - I would buy in a sec if it would be below 300K and if not, I will wait, I am in beginning of my 30's so hopefully I would be able to drive it few years from now with 400K-500K price paid.

    Ferrari and its artificial anti depreciation policy that we all know hurts only Ferrari and its owners in the long term, of course if they are true sport racing cars lovers.

    Re: Any word on how well 997 sales are going in the USA?

    Porsche made over a billion euro profit? Good for them! I'm going to add to their profit, by purchasing a 997S. And, I'm going to convince my kids to also buy Porsches, when they are old enough.

    Re: Any word on how well 997 sales are going in the USA?

    1* Sportcar enthusiasts buy the car they most have fun with driving thats within thier posibilities. Poseurs buy "jewels to wear" and think of them as investments, therefore, even if they can afford it they wont buy a car they like if they loose a few bucks.

    2* Cali is not the representative of the world nick, quite the contrary. In Spain the 996 was rated as the least depreciated car on the market

    3* Porsche can boast a 1 billion profit becuase their product is so good it allows them to. The competition can't.

    4* Porsche the most expensive make in the planet? half the price of an equally performing Ferrari, lower maintenance,more reliable, and longer lasting than its competition, , better resale than Merc or BMW, and practical and versatile enough to be a daily driver as well as weekend car in one pricetag... yeah, nick, good one.

    Re: Any word on how well 997 sales are going in the USA?

    Quote:
    carlos fromspain said:
    1* Sportcar enthusiasts buy the car they most have fun with driving thats within thier posibilities. Poseurs buy "jewels to wear" and think of them as investments, therefore, even if they can afford it they wont buy a car they like if they loose a few bucks.

    2* Cali is not the representative of the world nick, quite the contrary. In Spain the 996 was rated as the least depreciated car on the market

    3* Porsche can boast a 1 billion profit becuase their product is so good it allows them to. The competition can't.

    4* Porsche the most expensive make in the planet? half the price of an equally performing Ferrari, lower maintenance,more reliable, and longer lasting than its competition, , better resale than Merc or BMW, and practical and versatile enough to be a daily driver as well as weekend car in one pricetag... yeah, nick, good one.



    Well said. Might I add that even if what Nick says about depreciation and huge profits being indicators of an overpriced product are correct at all, the only thing I would think Porsche should do is lower their prices slightly (so I could afford one). Nick's absurd suggestion about lowering production numbers just makes completely clear his view of cars as exclusive suits that you put on for special occasions and then sell later as return for an investment. Low production numbers would drive maintenance prices up, make parts less available, and make a less reliable and usable product. What fun is a sports car that you can't use whenever you want to and beat on every weekend at the track?

    Re: Any word on how well 997 sales are going in the USA?

    Absolutely agree Keith, low production numbers are OK for special model versions and special models, but for a Carrera?...

    Nick is just mad that a "common" car (by his definition) can kick his Spider's butt in every objective aspect including performance and just can't stand it, you know, those pesky Porsche are everywere and take away from his "essence of style" while sittin' in his car when they are around hence his grudge on Porsche or agenda that is now focused on the 997

    Re: Any word on how well 997 sales are going in the USA?

    Roughly 800 millions Euro from Porsche's profit supposedly stem from a complicated exchange rate backup system that Porsche's finance department conceived. Only 200 millions were actually earned by selling cars.

    Let's face it. With their current system Ferrari would not be able to survive as an independant company. I think I have read that they are even making a loss this year.

    RG TL

    Re: Any word on how well 997 sales are going in the USA?

    Quote:
    carlos fromspain said:

    2* Cali is not the representative of the world nick, quite the contrary. In Spain the 996 was rated as the least depreciated car on the market



    Cali is not representative of the world but we are about 20% of Porsche's market. In a recent study, the 996 also came up as the least depreciated car on the market.

    Re: Any word on how well 997 sales are going in the USA?

    Quote:
    vtrader said:
    Cali is not representative of the world but we are about 20% of Porsche's market. In a recent study, the 996 also came up as the least depreciated car on the market.



    So whats all this nagging I hear about depreciation? I'd understand complaining about resale if you bought an Alfa Romeo or a FIAT, now that more than the reasonable for a depreciating asset a car is, but whinning about a 911's depreciation?

    Re: Any word on how well 997 sales are going in the USA?

    Quote:
    dhayek said:

    ,i,can tell you few things that may relief you from your endless quest of porsche scrap talk: ,and surely not from your kind of talk,if you think you are convincing anybody,you are wrong,people are laughing at your poseur points of views.porsche will continue (thanks god) to ignore your complaints because luckily they can make a difference when somebody is talking for a real issue or just to play the snob.and to finish,just to satisfy my curiosity,why are you waisting your time on this and every forum on the planet with the same talk over and over,its solved ,



    Why don't you just make a reasonable, informed and logical counter argument to what he said, OR IGNORE what he said. Insted you try to intimidate, humiliate and insult.

    Re: Any word on how well 997 sales are going in the USA?

    Quote:
    carlos fromspain said:
    Quote:
    vtrader said:
    Cali is not representative of the world but we are about 20% of Porsche's market. In a recent study, the 996 also came up as the least depreciated car on the market.



    So whats all this nagging I hear about depreciation? I'd understand complaining about resale if you bought an Alfa Romeo or a FIAT, now that more than the reasonable for a depreciating asset a car is, but whinning about a 911's depreciation?



    Carlos: California is a great Porsche state, with lots of true enthusiasts, but of course a few morons... that's the exception that proves the rule.

    Re: Any word on how well 997 sales are going in the USA?

    FWIW, I just purchased a 997S and also have a '01 360F1. I love both cars and feel that they really compliment each other. The P-car has been a great experience so far(my second P-car). I was surprised to be able to walk into a dealer and pay sticker less than a week after its launch. Service has been excellent. I had them take care of a couple of minor things. The reason I say they compliment each other is the F is great for occasional weekend stuff. The car attracts more attention so it requires keeping an eye on it more. Driving it is a real rush. The P on the other hand is more of a daily driver and completely reliable. I'd say it's a 9.2 on the driving excitement scale for me while the F is a 9.5. Having said that, I'm driving the P a lot more. So, rather than getting into all this jibberish about resale etc. relax, and get both, for their unigue characteristics. It's all about what you make of it anyway.

    Re: Any word on how well 997 sales are going in the USA?

    Quote:
    MaxErnst said:
    Quote:
    dhayek said:

    ,i,can tell you few things that may relief you from your endless quest of porsche scrap talk: ,and surely not from your kind of talk,if you think you are convincing anybody,you are wrong,people are laughing at your poseur points of views.porsche will continue (thanks god) to ignore your complaints because luckily they can make a difference when somebody is talking for a real issue or just to play the snob.and to finish,just to satisfy my curiosity,why are you waisting your time on this and every forum on the planet with the same talk over and over,its solved ,



    Why don't you just make a reasonable, informed and logical counter argument to what he said, OR IGNORE what he said. Insted you try to intimidate, humiliate and insult.


    oooops sorry max ,i told something wrong to the only person that thinks like you in the forum .
    to answer your question:i have absolutly no lesson to take from you ,so please dont lecture me .
    and to answer your thread ,here is the sales report of porsche north america,they sold 376 997 in 4 days...any other negative question to be asked?

    Porsche Cars North America Reports August Sales

    Porsche Cars North America Reports August Sales
    Text courtesy Porsche Cars North America
    edited 09-02-2004
    * Sales Up 13 Percent
    * Demand Strong for New 911
    Porsche Cars North America, Inc. (PCNA), importer and distributor of Porsche sports cars and Cayenne SUVs in the United States and Canada, today announced U.S. retail sales totaled 2,562 vehicles in August, an increase of 13 percent. Year-to-date sales were up 16 percent. The new Porsche 911 Carrera and Carrera S together accounted for nearly 15 percent of the monthly total.
    "PCNA is off to a great start with the new 911," said PCNA CEO Peter Schwarzenbauer. "In just four days time our customers have purchased 376 of the new models. The new 911 combines the engineering our customers expect with the best of the Porsche's sports car tradition."
    In addition, dealers sold 359 Porsche Approved Certified Pre-Owned vehicles. Pre-Owned sales were up 66 percent for the month and 590 percent for the calendar year.

    Re: Any word on how well 997 sales are going in the USA?

    Before we predict the "failure" of Porsche in general and the "failure" of the 997 itself, let's wait until this time next year and check the real sales numbers.

    Re: Any word on how well 997 sales are going in the USA?

    If you want a 997 in the UK and went to a dealer today you would need to go on a waiting list and wait untill August 05 before you could get a build slot. Also there are no pre owned 997's for sale at any porsche dealers only a few in the Sunday times for above list.

    Dealers are also not allowed to even talk or take deposits on the demonstrators they have so demand is quite high

    Re: Any word on how well 997 sales are going in the USA?

    Quote:
    dhayek said:

    "PCNA is off to a great start with the new 911," said PCNA CEO Peter Schwarzenbauer. "In just four days time our customers have purchased 376 of the new models. The new 911 combines the engineering our customers expect with the best of the Porsche's sports car tradition."
    In addition, dealers sold 359 Porsche Approved Certified Pre-Owned vehicles. Pre-Owned sales were up 66 percent for the month and 590 percent for the calendar year.




    Been there done that, yeah, the "news:" an outdated official company press release.

    You're a wild and crazy guy.

    Re: Any word on how well 997 sales are going in the USA?

    Quote:

    The answer; Porsche is the most expensive sport car on the planet. How can I make that statement? If you factor in resale value ( a point made by another poster) the car relative to other sport cars is more expensive. The car drops like a rock once of the show room floor and for good reason. It is overproduced, overpriced and not special.



    don't ever relate to the 360 spider -- 456M GT, 550/575M, murcielago, masers, merc CL, BMW Z8... they all suffer from a high depreciation.

    Quote:
    The car is not being that well received by the buying public despite the positive press.



    i share this impression. the press wrote raving reviews and praised the car as a "true 911" etc etc

    but most people i know personally don't like it very much and especially it's beetle-esque front.

    i even don't get why the press is always writing that they are glad that the era of the "fried egg frontlights" is over... forgot about the MY02 facelift?

    and that the legendary coke bottle form is a must for the 911. if i remember it right, this distinctive waistline was introduced with the 993. first 911's have been very slim.

    seems to me that a lot of "journalists" just stick to the official press release.

     
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