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    2010 GT3 ceramic breaks

     Hi,

    I have a friend with a 2010 GT3 and has the Regular Red Brakes, they squeak a lot. Not so bad when going slow but they do squeak. So I went with the ceramic brakes on my 2010 GT3 order. Anyone with ceramic brakes on their 2010 GT3 experience any squeaking?

    Thanks


    Re: 2010 GT3 ceramic breaks

     the squeeking noice was very much reduced with the 997 series. its depents how you use the car. after a track day there might be some slight squeeking noice. if you change break pads to either Pagid P50 (Super Cup) or for example Endless, which I am using, there might be quite louds squeeks. 

     

    greets rantanplan


    --
    997 GT3 clubsport

    Re: 2010 GT3 ceramic breaks

    Not sure if the PCCB's on the Turbo are the same as the GT3 but the ones on my Turbo don't squeak. I did have the same experience as your friend w/ the Red's on my 997 S cab. , it wasn't bad at all but every so often during a lazy stop they did squeal a little.  

    When do you expect your car?


    --

    08 PORSCHE Turbo Cabriolet, 06 Ferrari F430,  04 Durango HEMI,  04 Harley Davidson Screamin Eagle,  93 Harley Davidson Nostalgia


    Re: 2010 GT3 ceramic breaks

     Thanks for the info. 

    I am expecting the car sometime in November. I am trading in my 2009 4s . After driving my friend's GT3 I just could not resist.


    Re: 2010 GT3 ceramic breaks

    Hani:

     Thanks for the info. 

    I am expecting the car sometime in November. I am trading in my 2009 4s . After driving my friend's GT3 I just could not resist.

     

    I'm a HUGE fan of the PCCB's, I wouldn't order a Porsche without them again. IMHO you made such a great decision there ESPECIALLY on a GT3.

    What will your car look like?


    --

    08 PORSCHE Turbo Cabriolet, 06 Ferrari F430,  04 Durango HEMI,  04 Harley Davidson Screamin Eagle,  93 Harley Davidson Nostalgia


    Re: 2010 GT3 ceramic breaks

    Black Ext/ Black Int 

    Ø     Automatically dimming interior exterior mirrors

    Ø     Dynamic cornering light

    Ø     Rear lights in clear glass optics, tinted windshield in clear glass optics with red deflector

    Ø     Ceramic breaks (PCCB)

    Ø     Dynamic engine mounting: electronically adjustable engine mounting with variable rigidity & absorption, for an increased traveling comfort by a flexible binding

    Ø     Sport Chrono Package plus

    Ø     Adaptive sport seats, full adjustment of all seat functions with seat cover in leather, seat inlay in Alcantara

    Ø     Decorative trim on gear lever painted in exterior color

    Ø     Door opener painted

    Ø     Door opener trim painted

    Ø     Trim strip switch panel painted in exterior color

    Ø     Sport seat backrest painted in exterior color

    Ø     Rear center console in exterior color

    Ø     Leather interior in standard color

    Ø     Floor mats with leather edging

    Ø     Porsche Communication Management, PCM, 6.5" TFT -Color Touch screen Display, Audio System with Cd-/DVD- Player for MP3  Music & Audio-/Video/DVD's (incl. trip computer & DVD navigation system), only with sound package plus

    Ø     Telephone module (Bluetooth SAP), only with PCM

    Ø     Homelink (433 MHZ)

    Ø     Sound package plus, with 9 loudspeakers & 235 Watt output

     

    These are the options on my car :)


    Re: 2010 GT3 ceramic breaks

    I ordered my GT3 just a few days ago and the salesperson was literally talking me out of PCCB. They seem to have massive problems with the system and there are already several law suits going on here in Germany as I was told. The reason is that if used on racetracks, one will apparently have to renew not only the brake pads but also the discs after a relatively short period of time and Porsche charges about 20.000,-- Euro for that.

    Furthermore, the new lightweight battery which is offered seems also to cause problems as it goes flat after a very short period of time as well. So if you are not using the car on a daily basis, you might consider staying with the "old school" battery.


    Re: 2010 GT3 ceramic breaks

     From what I understood after reading so many forums is that the generation 1 PCCb had that problem. Don't think it is still an issue. 

    The main reason I went PCCB is the squeaking, it is very terrible on the Reds. Given I use my car as a DD also I really can not be driving and squeaking all day long. 

    I have the PCCBs on my current 2009 4s and I haven't had any problems yet.

    I


    Re: 2010 GT3 ceramic breaks

    Hani:

     From what I understood after reading so many forums is that the generation 1 PCCb had that problem. Don't think it is still an issue. 

    The main reason I went PCCB is the squeaking, it is very terrible on the Reds. Given I use my car as a DD also I really can not be driving and squeaking all day long. 

    I have the PCCBs on my current 2009 4s and I haven't had any problems yet.

    I

     

    The PCCB discs are good for tens of thousands of street miles. I've seen reports (that I came across when researching whether to get PCCB's) of over 100k miles of hard street driving w/ some track.  I could dig the reports out probably if you want to see them. If you track the car constantly there have been people that  have said they would prefer steel because of the replacement costs of the PCCB discs but I don't think I've heard yet from a single person that drives mainly on the street that has even needed to replace 3rd gen PCCB discs yet even w/ doing pad changes.... However ------ w/ steel brakes you should be replacing the discs with at least every other pad change (at least that's what Porsche recommends, some dealers like mine rec w/ every pad change & wont cut rotors, they will only replace w/ new steel discs)  so that alone could add thousands of dollars to the costs of owning Red's over time which most people don't account for.  Besides better braking performance, better handling/ less un-sprung weight, better acceleration you get a HUGE benefit if you wash & detail your own car, the reds not only create a huge amount of brake dust but when you wash your car as soon as you drive off they dump a dirty soup of rusty water into your wheels.  It was the only thing I despised w/ my 997 S Cab.  It used to take me as long to clean the calipers & wheels as it did the whole rest of the car. Of course there's also the sharper look not just w/ the larger discs but because the discs wont get rusty & calipers don't get so gungked up like what happens  w/ the iron brakes.  I've owned 2 steel brake Porsche's, one Ceramic & 2 Ceramic F-cars, currently have ceramics on both my Turbo & F430. There's no right or wrong , it's a matter of preference some people swear by the reds but I wouldnt buy another P-car or F-car w/ out Ceramics.   

    --

    08 PORSCHE Turbo Cabriolet, 06 Ferrari F430,  04 Durango HEMI,  04 Harley Davidson Screamin Eagle,  93 Harley Davidson Nostalgia


    Re: 2010 GT3 ceramic breaks

    Hani:

    Black Ext/ Black Int 

    Ø     Automatically dimming interior exterior mirrors

    Ø     Dynamic cornering light

    Ø     Rear lights in clear glass optics, tinted windshield in clear glass optics with red deflector

    Ø     Ceramic breaks (PCCB)

    Ø     Dynamic engine mounting: electronically adjustable engine mounting with variable rigidity & absorption, for an increased traveling comfort by a flexible binding

    Ø     Sport Chrono Package plus

    Ø     Adaptive sport seats, full adjustment of all seat functions with seat cover in leather, seat inlay in Alcantara

    Ø     Decorative trim on gear lever painted in exterior color

    Ø     Door opener painted

    Ø     Door opener trim painted

    Ø     Trim strip switch panel painted in exterior color

    Ø     Sport seat backrest painted in exterior color

    Ø     Rear center console in exterior color

    Ø     Leather interior in standard color

    Ø     Floor mats with leather edging

    Ø     Porsche Communication Management, PCM, 6.5" TFT -Color Touch screen Display, Audio System with Cd-/DVD- Player for MP3  Music & Audio-/Video/DVD's (incl. trip computer & DVD navigation system), only with sound package plus

    Ø     Telephone module (Bluetooth SAP), only with PCM

    Ø     Homelink (433 MHZ)

    Ø     Sound package plus, with 9 loudspeakers & 235 Watt output

     

    These are the options on my car :)

     

    Awesome.

    Black on Black a man after my own heart. Smiley

    Make sure to post pics !!!!


    --

    08 PORSCHE Turbo Cabriolet, 06 Ferrari F430,  04 Durango HEMI,  04 Harley Davidson Screamin Eagle,  93 Harley Davidson Nostalgia


    Re: 2010 GT3 ceramic breaks

    8000RPM,

    I've heard from guys w/ frequent track use going w/ steel instead so if you're going to track often that may be the better or at least less costly option.  It has to do with how hot they get, as they get extremely hot, like glowing on a race car the wear increases but w/ a street car this is less likely/often.

    Here's some info I had gathered a while back, some of it is more useful than other's, some of it repeats. The info I was really looking for but couldn't find was from someone at the "Porsche Driving Experience" on cars with 100k w/ track mileage showed less than .01mm wear at the rotor. 

    ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

     

    Porsche Christophorus Magazine April/May 2001
     
    "In the test program, the ceramic disks and Brembo calipers have withstood
    twenty such hard braking cycles from 250 km/h (155 mph) to 100 km/h (62 mph)
    without any decrease in braking effectiveness. And with somewhat more
    sensible use, the silicon-carbide discs should last 300,000 kilometers
    (185,000 miles)."
     
    Porsche Cars North America, Inc. 2000 911 Turbo Literature:
     
    "Porsche Ceramic Composite Brakes: Strong enough to stop time. (Or, at
    least, wear and tear)
     
    Once again, Porsche has stopped conventional thinking in its tracks by being
    the first to offer a revolutionary new ceramic brake disc as an option on
    the new 911 Turbo. Called Porsche Ceramic Composite Brakes (PCCB), this new
    technology shatters benchmarks in every respect.
     
    While it’s dimensions are similar, a ceramic brake disc weighs 50 percent
    less than its cast-iron counterpart, reducing unsprung weight by 44lts for
    improved handling. Armed with new composite metal linings, ceramic brakes
    maintain their frictional coefficient regardless of temperature for the
    ultimate in fade-free stopping power. Cross-drilled discs and water
    resistant brake linings ensure equally superior performance in wet weather. 
     
    PCCB technology achieves immediate emergency braking without having to stomp
    on the brake pedal. It’s service life is every bit as effortless: the
    ceramic’s hard surface and corrosion-free properties allow a brake disc to
    last as long as the car itself. Which, for a Porsche, is a long time
    indeed."
     
    Porsche Panorama, April 2001
     
    "In use, these are brakes with no sense of humor, and somewhere in the
    owner’s manual it better say “don’t put your foot on the brakes unless you
    look in the rear view mirror first.” There might also need to be a word
    about having enough air in your lungs to go without breathing for a while
    during operation of the ceramic seizers. They are nevertheless quite linear
    and controllable, with sometimes a little pad squeak, but surprising little
    dust. They are reported to be very durable – as in forever – but be prepared
    to buy pads a bit more often."
     
    Suncoast Motors – 
     
    "The 911 GT2 comes with the most effective braking system ever featured on a
    production Porsche: the Porsche Ceramic Composite Brake (PCCB). This is a
    powerful new technology designed to cope with even the most extreme
    conditions on racetrack and road. 
    At the heart of the new technology is a ceramic brake disc made of specially
    treated carbon fibre silicated in a high-vacuum process at approximately
    1,700 ºC. The PCCB disc is cross-drilled and internally vented, and is
    approximately 50% lighter than conventional alternatives. Since this weight
    is unsprung, i.e., not supported by the suspension, PCCB automatically
    improves agility and handling. Another feature of the system is the
    innovative new composite brake pad, which combines with the ceramic disc to
    deliver extremely high and constant levels of friction under braking. By
    replacing conventional metal components with composite pads and discs,
    temperature is no longer a factor in brake performance. This configuration
    not only helps minimise braking distances - particularly under heavy use -
    it also ensures safer deceleration from high speed thanks to improved fade
    resistance. 
    In an emergency stop, PCCB immediately delivers maximum stopping power to
    the road. Abrasion is extremely low compared with metal discs, with each
    PCCB disc offering a service life of approximately 300,000 km. The new
    composite brake pads also last around twice as long as conventional ones.
    What's more, the new PCCB pads do not absorb water, making for outstanding
    performance in the wet.
     
    http://www.europeancarweb.com/tech/0406ec_install_carbon_ceramic_brakes/
     
     
    >From Ward's Auto World
     
    new ceramic-composite rotors can withstand a maximum temperature load of
    2,550 degrees F (1,400 degree C) and exhibit low levels of thermal
    expansion, reducing brake "judder" (jar and shudder) and squeal under hard
    use. The discs are said to be good for 186,000 miles (300,000 km) of use -
    and they do not corrode.
     
     
    The Car Connection
    Ceramic composites
    The Porsche system, called "Porsche Ceramic Composite Brake" or "PCCB" will be about a $10,000 option on the 911 Turbo and will be standard equipment on the 911 GT2. The PCCB system will use a distinctive yellow caliper at each wheel and will reduce weight at each corner to the tune of about 11 lbs., thus the PCCB system weighs about half that of the standard system. The rotors look remarkably like the iron versions they replace since they are vented and cross-drilled. The rotors are machined as needed and attached to the racing style composite hub - another weight saving feature due its precise, computer-aided design. Porsche claims a life of at least 100k miles in addition to an immunity to corrosion and better wet braking due to the special metallic pads not absorbing any water. The primary benefits of PCCB are thus greatly improved wet or dry stopping power with reduced fade; improved suspension response/handling, and improved acceleration (due to less rotational inertia in the all wheel drive powertrain). >From Automania For example, Porsche Ceramic Composite Brakes (PCCB) use a cross-drilled, carbon fiber reinforced ceramic disc with special composite pads. The new PCCB brake disc weighs 50 percent less than its cast-iron counterpart despite considerably larger dimensions. Another key benefit of PCCB is the carbon brake’s exceptional life. While the actual rate of wear on all brake components, particularly pads and discs, is entirely dependent on individual driving style and vehicle usage, comparison testing reveals a much longer life expectancy with PCCB than with conventional braking systems, where Porsche claim 250,000 km or more under normal driving conditions. http://www.hydroaire.com/downloads/BrakeSavings.pdf >From Automotive Intelligent News For the first time the new Carrera features ceramic brake discs enhanced to an even higher standard, the new design of the interior cooling ducts increasing the flow of cool air through the spinning disc. At the same time the larger number of cooling ducts increases disc rigidity, in the process significantly reducing deformation of the disc under high pressure. A further point is the optimisation of fibre reinforcement on the friction surface of the brake discs, significantly enhancing the resistance to abrasion particularly under high loads. For the customer, these improvements mean even better performance, enhanced brake comfort, and even longer brake system life. >From Brembo, makers of the ceramic brakes for Porsche and Mercedes Ceramic composite brake rotors are standard on Formula One racers, and a new era of road-car use is beginning with their optional - and super high-cost - fitment on bad-boy models like the Porsche 911 Turbo and Mercedes-Benz CLK 55 F1. In addition to outrageous stopping power, the carbon ceramic brakes are claimed to reduce weight by almost 13 lbs. (5.8 kg) per rotor, and they're nearly impervious to heat-induced fade and will last for the life of the vehicle. >From Pagid Brakes Dieter Goldbach, President at BT Bremsen, says, “Through our relationship with Porsche we have, in the past few years, been working on ceramic pads and discs for road cars like the GT2, GT3 and the new Carrera GT. With Porsche we have also developed a friction material that is used in the ceramic clutch in the Carrera GT. Our very latest development, ceramic-based friction materials for use with steel discs, has also come out of this programme.” The very high thermal capacity of ceramic-based materials means that, unlike organic based materials, they are not affected by any heat levels normally generated by a car and have proved to be ideal for high performance applications. The development work on these materials has also shown potential advantages for the use of ceramic-based materials with steel discs and in the near future Pagid will be introducing new pads that have resulted from this experience. Goldbach explains: “The pads we use with steel discs have a ceramic content but they are not pure ceramic. A ceramic disc does not store heat like a steel disc – it transfers a lot of heat into the pad so we have had to develop a new kind of pad that can handle high disc surface temperatures.” Of course this has implications for the other parts of the braking system. In Goldbach’s view, the brake equipment manufactures must accept that that high performance brake systems can cause some heat problems, especially with the brake fluid. “I think the caliper manufacturers need to look at their designs to help in this regard,” he says. “Today it’s possible to make pads that can handle far more thermal load that the rest of the system can handle.” Nevertheless, Goldbach is convinced hat ceramic and ceramic-based materials are the way of the future for both the road and the track. “Ceramic discs and pads have an important advantage over carbon in their cold friction characteristics,” he says. “Carbon discs and pads will only work properly within a limited temperature window. If they get too hot, the wear rate goes up; if they are too cold, the friction co-efficient is reduced. Also, the weight of a ceramic disc is only a fraction of the weight of a steel disc and not significantly heavier than a carbon disc. “For racing, ceramic brake technology needs to be slightly different to the way it has been made to work on road cars, but I think in a year o two you might see Porsche and others using ceramic brakes in races.” When Pagid’s ceramic development programme started five years ago, it was a highly confidential project. Like all brake pad manufacturers, Pagid’ method of attaching its friction material to the metal backing plate is also a sensitive area. Nevertheless, Goldbach offers a glimpse of how it is done: “Like all other manufacturers we have a special patented method,” he says. “High pad temperatures can lead to problems in the binding of the friction to the metal backplate, especially with ceramic brake pads. Our attachment method is a special mechanical arrangement that penetrates deeply into the construction of the pad. “The temperatures generated in racing and high performance braking can lead to cracks appearing in the friction material. Our patented attachment method means that the material will stay solid on the back plate without harming the disc and guarantees that the brakes will work properly. We call it out ‘Safety Lock’ system.”

     


    --

    08 PORSCHE Turbo Cabriolet, 06 Ferrari F430,  04 Durango HEMI,  04 Harley Davidson Screamin Eagle,  93 Harley Davidson Nostalgia


    Re: 2010 GT3 ceramic breaks

    Hani:

     From what I understood after reading so many forums is that the generation 1 PCCb had that problem. Don't think it is still an issue. 

    The main reason I went PCCB is the squeaking, it is very terrible on the Reds. Given I use my car as a DD also I really can not be driving and squeaking all day long. 

    I have the PCCBs on my current 2009 4s and I haven't had any problems yet.

     

    I am sorry but have to disagree that there has only been one problem with PCCB so far. one thing has to be clear, the ceramic break discs last superbly under any circumstance on street. However, under heavy track use they will defenetely break at some point. i have seen numerous GT3 that have gotten 4 new rotors after sometimes less than 10,000 km and i have seen many that changed the ceramic discs to steel after that to avoid around EUR 12,000 for replacement ceramic discs. 

    PCCB works great and there is basically no break fading but they do wear out when using on track and it will cost a lot of money to replace them. 

    on break intensive tracks like Monza and Hockenheim I was recommended by Olaf Manthey himself to use endless break pads to improve durablity of the rotors.

    the regular pads are fine for tracks like Nordschleife which is not as hard on the breaks. I have been doing well so far and the rotors still look ok after 14000km. but the squeeking noice of the endless pads is way to loud for street use.

     

    greets rantanplan 

    I

     


    --
    997 GT3 clubsport


    Re: 2010 GT3 ceramic breaks

    another confirmation that PCCB are perfect for street but all the gentlemen drivers replaceded pccb where standard with steel or cup steel brakes


    --
    Dedi La vita è troppo corta per non guidare italiano.....

    Re: 2010 GT3 ceramic breaks

     Anyone know the cost of replacement steel disks and pads on the 2010 cars ?

    As they are bespoke for the GT3 it might make the cost argument for PCCB better.

     

     


    Re: 2010 GT3 ceramic breaks

    cdixon:

     Anyone know the cost of replacement steel disks and pads on the 2010 cars ?

    As they are bespoke for the GT3 it might make the cost argument for PCCB better.

     

     

     

    I just got conformation from my OPC the steel rotors and pads cost as follows:-

    Prices at the moment are Front £1400 & Rear £1300, including VAT.


    Re: 2010 GT3 ceramic breaks

    I go to High Performance Driver Education events a lot.  Occasionally when we come off the track, I'll forget and pull on the parking brake.  The instructor will immediately tell me, "Don't set the parking brake!  The rotors are too hot!  You'll warp your rotors!"  I always comply, of course, but frankly, with PCCB brakes I don't think it matters.


    --

    2008 GT3

     


    Re: 2010 GT3 ceramic breaks

    Greentree:

    I go to High Performance Driver Education events a lot.  Occasionally when we come off the track, I'll forget and pull on the parking brake.  The instructor will immediately tell me, "Don't set the parking brake!  The rotors are too hot!  You'll warp your rotors!"  I always comply, of course, but frankly, with PCCB brakes I don't think it matters.


    So how do the PCCB perform/hold up at the track. My experience with them on the street has been extremely positive but would love to hear from someone who puts them to proper use. Since the cars with ceramics that I have driven belong to my old man I haven't had the opportunity, but would LOVE to thrash his '10 GT3 in its proper environment! Smiley


    Re: 2010 GT3 ceramic breaks

    trip:
    Greentree:

    I go to High Performance Driver Education events a lot.  Occasionally when we come off the track, I'll forget and pull on the parking brake.  The instructor will immediately tell me, "Don't set the parking brake!  The rotors are too hot!  You'll warp your rotors!"  I always comply, of course, but frankly, with PCCB brakes I don't think it matters.


    So how do the PCCB perform/hold up at the track. My experience with them on the street has been extremely positive but would love to hear from someone who puts them to proper use. Since the cars with ceramics that I have driven belong to my old man I haven't had the opportunity, but would LOVE to thrash his '10 GT3 in its proper environment! Smiley



     

    My personal experience is that PCCB rotor life time depends on the tracks you drive. 

    If you prefer GP style tracks like HHR or Porsche's track in Leipzig the rear rotors on a GT2 are done after about 1500-2000km of track driving. The front rotors (larger in size...) are good for about 3000-4000km. The pads are usually good for about 500km on these tracks.

    If you prefer tracks that are less heavy for the brakes (like NBR, either NS or GP) the life time should be (significantly) longer than stated above.

    For street driving there seems to be no limit in terms of km. Probably good for 200000km or so Smiley


    Re: 2010 GT3 ceramic breaks

    @cdixon: for your future convenience, you can find out the fixed prices for replacing front and/or rear brake disks and/or pads from the following webpage:

    http://www.porsche.com/uk/accessoriesandservice/porscheservice/servicepricing/

     


    --

    RT Moderator - 997.1 Carrera S GT Silver/Cocoa, -20mm/LSD, PSE, short shifter, SportDesign rims, Zuffenhausen collection


    Re: 2010 GT3 ceramic breaks

    easy_rider911:

    @cdixon: for your future convenience, you can find out the fixed prices for replacing front and/or rear brake disks and/or pads from the following webpage:

    http://www.porsche.com/uk/accessoriesandservice/porscheservice/servicepricing/

     

     Yep i check this quite often, at the moment no prices on that link as they are in the process of  rewriting prices. I guess to cover GT3(RS) and Panamera

     


    Re: 2010 GT3 ceramic breaks

    MKSGR:


    My personal experience is that PCCB rotor life time depends on the tracks you drive. 

    If you prefer GP style tracks like HHR or Porsche's track in Leipzig the rear rotors on a GT2 are done after about 1500-2000km of track driving. The front rotors (larger in size...) are good for about 3000-4000km. The pads are usually good for about 500km on these tracks.

    If you prefer tracks that are less heavy for the brakes (like NBR, either NS or GP) the life time should be (significantly) longer than stated above.

    For street driving there seems to be no limit in terms of km. Probably good for 200000km or so Smiley


    Very interesting post and so far the best documentation that I've seen of "something" going on with the programs that control braking in 911.
    It's always been a puzzle to me why some people would have their PCCB brakes fried at the track, and some would have no problem. I thought it was driver's technique, but it makes more sense that the track is a more important factor.

    The more interesting issue to me is which program is doing this? PSM? ABS?


    --

    Regards,
    Can
    997 Turbo + Bilstein Damptronic ( Review ) + GIAC ECU Tune ( Fast as a torpedo & reversible to stock - Review ) + Cargraphic Exhaust ( Oh heavenly noise! )


    Re: 2010 GT3 ceramic breaks

    cannga:
    MKSGR:


    My personal experience is that PCCB rotor life time depends on the tracks you drive. 

    If you prefer GP style tracks like HHR or Porsche's track in Leipzig the rear rotors on a GT2 are done after about 1500-2000km of track driving. The front rotors (larger in size...) are good for about 3000-4000km. The pads are usually good for about 500km on these tracks.

    If you prefer tracks that are less heavy for the brakes (like NBR, either NS or GP) the life time should be (significantly) longer than stated above.

    For street driving there seems to be no limit in terms of km. Probably good for 200000km or so Smiley


    Very interesting post and so far the best documentation that I've seen of "something" going on with the programs that control braking in 911.
    It's always been a puzzle to me why some people would have their PCCB brakes fried at the track, and some would have no problem. I thought it was driver's technique, but it makes more sense that the track is a more important factor.

    The more interesting issue to me is which program is doing this? PSM? ABS?

     I think there is a "test" to see whether brake wear is PSM/ABS related or due to proper but intense use: if the rear discs wear significantly faster than the front discs the problem is more driver related (too much PSM interaction...). If the wear is similar front and rear PCCB itself is the limiting factor. In the end the brakes convert massive energy into heat. No wonder that wear can be quite significant even with latest PCCB technology Smiley


    Re: 2010 GT3 ceramic breaks

    In the name of all that is sacred, is it too much to ask to spell it "brakes" in the title? Makes me cringe when posters on a car site can get it wright, err rite, err right.


    Re: 2010 GT3 ceramic breaks

    savvy, I'm with you on this one - but good spelling died with the advent of informality on the internet and SMS text messaging 

    Actually, in a funny sort of way, 'breaks' is kind of appropriate - given how people are writing about durability and the propensity for brakes not to last when subjected to the rigours of track use


    --

     
    RT Moderator - 997.1 Carrera S GT Silver/Cocoa, -20mm/LSD, PSE, short shifter, SportDesign rims, Zuffenhausen collection


    Re: 2010 GT3 ceramic breaks

    MKSGR:

     I think there is a "test" to see whether brake wear is PSM/ABS related or due to proper but intense use: if the rear discs wear significantly faster than the front discs the problem is more driver related (too much PSM interaction...). If the wear is similar front and rear PCCB itself is the limiting factor. In the end the brakes convert massive energy into heat. No wonder that wear can be quite significant even with latest PCCB technology Smiley


     

    So to prevent damage to PCCB at the track, you would turn off both components of the GT2's PSM --Stability Control & Traction Control? (Not that I think it's advisable to do so.)

    And if you do this and still fry your brakes at the track, then you could reason that  it IS the ABS that causes the damage?

    Found a good site to read about 911 PSM: http://www.porsche.com/microsite/technology/default.aspx?pool=usa&ShowSingleTechterm=PTPSM&Category=&Model=&SearchedString=&SelectedVariant=PMT911GT2


    --

    Regards,
    Can
    997 Turbo + Bilstein Damptronic ( Review ) + GIAC ECU Tune ( Fast as a torpedo & reversible to stock - Review ) + Cargraphic Exhaust ( Oh heavenly noise! )


    Re: 2010 GT3 ceramic breaks

    savvy:

    In the name of all that is sacred, is it too much to ask to spell it "brakes" in the title? Makes me cringe when posters on a car site can get it wright, err rite, err right.

    Well, savvy, you do need to make some allowance for the fact that rennteam.com is a very international site,so many (most?) posters are not native English speakers (or writers).  Smiley

    If you want to cringe some more, you spelled "cannot" as "can". Smiley   Smiley


    --

    fritz


    Re: 2010 GT3 ceramic breaks

    fritz:
    savvy:

    In the name of all that is sacred, is it too much to ask to spell it "brakes" in the title? Makes me cringe when posters on a car site can get it wright, err rite, err right.

    Well, savvy, you do need to make some allowance for the fact that rennteam.com is a very international site,so many (most?) posters are not native English speakers (or writers).  Smiley

    If you want to cringe some more, you spelled "cannot" as "can". Smiley   Smiley

    You are surely correct that I screwed that up and it was cringe worthy! Smiley Cannot was indeed the intended wording.

    And I am fully accepting of tires vs tyres.

    But brakes are never breaks ! Smiley

     


    Re: 2010 GT3 ceramic breaks

    savvy:

    ... And I am fully accepting of tires vs tyres ...


    And so you should be! 'Tyres' is how we spell it in England where the English language comes from! Smiley

    It's us who deserve a medal for tolerating the verbal mutilation that Americans inflict upon our beloved language! Smiley Smiley


    --

     
    RT Moderator - 997.1 Carrera S GT Silver/Cocoa, -20mm/LSD, PSE, short shifter, SportDesign rims, Zuffenhausen collection


    Re: 2010 GT3 ceramic breaks

    easy_rider911:

    It's us who deserve a medal for tolerating the verbal mutilation that Americans inflict upon our beloved language! Smiley Smiley

    The correct "English" grammar is "It's WE who deserve..."Smiley
     


    --

    73 Carrera RS 2.7 Carbon Fiber replica (1,890 lbs).  Former: 73 911S, Two 951S's, 996 C2, 993 C2, 98 Ferrari 550 Maranello


    Re: 2010 GT3 ceramic breaks

    Grant:
    easy_rider911:

    It's us who deserve a medal for tolerating the verbal mutilation that Americans inflict upon our beloved language! Smiley Smiley

    The correct "English" grammar is "It's WE who deserve..."Smiley
     

     
    LOL Smiley That must be a difference in grammar between us too Smiley

     


    --

     
    RT Moderator - 997.1 Carrera S GT Silver/Cocoa, -20mm/LSD, PSE, short shifter, SportDesign rims, Zuffenhausen collection


     
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