Crown

Board: Porsche - 911 - 997 - Turbo Language: English Region: Worldwide Share/Save/Bookmark Close

Forum - Thread


    Re: Well yeehaw and golleee.

    Quote:
    nberry said:
    Quote:
    twinturbo001 said:
    I own both cars a 07Z and a 997TT and there is no comparison the TT is a far better car.




    I assume you bought the TT for all around performance. The Z06 beats it in every performance category.



    Heres another example of the 997tt edging the corvette. The point is as can be clearly seen..these cars are both very fast. From dead stop the AWD traction advantage favours the 997tt...from a rolling start the lighter weight favours the ZO6. http://www.dpccars.com/car-movies/12-04-06page-Porsche-997-Turbo-vs-Corvette-Zo6.htm
    But we being rational beings relie on objective Data...like the fact that the 997tt is faster on the Nurburgring than the ZO6...so as you can see it isn't inferior in all performance categories. But once again, your post was entertaining.

    Re: sorry Nick - tongue in cheek

    I was fortunate enough not to pay a premium. However, with those that do, they get their money back after one cycle of ownership.

    BTW, most Z06 owner's can afford to own a Porsche. They opt not to do so especially if their goal is performance. The 997 and 997S are road kill for the Z06. As far as driving excitement, clearly the Porsche has nothing over the Z06 especially the TT with its numbing AWD.

    Hey to each to their own. Some spend their money wisely. Others emotionally. I chose the former.

    Re: Well yeehaw and golleee.

    Loran wrote

    But we being rational beings relie on objective Data...like the fact that the 997tt is faster on the Nurburgring than the ZO6...so as you can see it isn't inferior in all performance categories. But once again, your post was entertaining.

    Wrong. The Z06 7:42 the 997TT 7:48. Of course all the Porsche owner's have questioned the Z06 time accusing GM of out right fraud. When will they learn.

    Re: Well yeehaw and golleee.

    Nick, define "lap time"

    Are you talking about a "flying lap" a "standing start" lap?

    A Ferrari lap? (secret with factory witch doctors present)

    A Porsche lap? (Walter Rorhl after 8 shots of expresso)

    A Jaguar XKR apparently now makes for the most FUN laps
    Watch it: EZ 110mph power slides

    Re: Well yeehaw and golleee.

    Quote:
    nberry said:
    Loran wrote

    But we being rational beings relie on objective Data...like the fact that the 997tt is faster on the Nurburgring than the ZO6...so as you can see it isn't inferior in all performance categories. But once again, your post was entertaining.

    Wrong. The Z06 7:42 the 997TT 7:48. Of course all the Porsche owner's have questioned the Z06 time accusing GM of out right fraud. When will they learn.


    Stradale was kind enough to share this us on June 29th...

    "Dun no but 7.40 looks pretty impressive when you look at the company:

    7:40 - 161.217 km/h - Bugatti 16/4 Veyron, 1001 PS/1980 kg (Wheels magazine Australia, 12/05)
    7:40 - 161.217 km/h - Mercedes Benz SLR McLaren, Klaus Ludwig (AutoBild 07/04)
    7:40 - 161.217 km/h - Porsche 997 Turbo, 480 PS/ ??? kg, Michelin Cup Sport tyres (Motortrend)
    7:42* - 160.519 km/h - Ford GT, 550 PS/ 1521 kg (*as indicated by Octane magazine, 11/05)
    7:42.9 - 160.207 km/h - Corvette Z06, 500 PS/1319 kg, Jan Magnusen, (Sporbilen, jun,26 05), www.supercars.net/Pics?vpf2=y&gID=3&fID=0&tID=10073&mID=1384471&l=d
    7:43 - 160.173 km/h - Porsche 996 GT3 RS, factory test driver Walter Roehrl (MOTOR magazine)
    7:43.5 - 160,000 km/h - Lamborghini Murcielago (Autocar magazine 02)


    A tie w/ the Bugatti & SLR beating the Ford GT, Z06 & GT3RS. Doesn't get much better than that imo.

    btw: Nick did say this would happen."

    Must have been a different Nick

    Re: Well yeehaw and golleee.

    Loran, the TT was running Cup tires which enhance perf. substantially over an almost 8 min run. When it ran with OEM tires the TT time was closer to 7:50.

    BTW, If I am not mistaken, the Z06 was running the no flat Goodyears. Had the Z06 been on Cup tires, no contest.

    Re: Well yeehaw and golleee.

    Quote:
    nberry said:
    Loran, the TT was running Cup tires which enhance perf. substantially over an almost 8 min run. When it ran with OEM tires the TT time was closer to 7:50.

    BTW, If I am not mistaken, the Z06 was running the no flat Goodyears. Had the Z06 been on Cup tires, no contest.


    I see, so GM didn't use it's best performing OEM rated tire on the ZO6...it what?? It used it's worst?...or better yet perhaps it's only tire?. So let me see how this plays out, the GM people sent Jan Magnusen out on the Nurburgring an extremely talented driver and handicapped him in everyway ..only to demonstrate they could not do their best... Or maybe Magnusen was out on the Nurburgring for a sunday drive and and someone accidentally timed him, if they had of known they wouldn't have placed a driver as capable as him behind the wheel, they would have put Granny Clampet behind the wheel..please Nick have a little pride...it'a not like we are talking about the F430

    Re: sorry Nick - tongue in cheek

    Quote:
    VGA18 said:
    Who cares if Z06 beats 997TT, F430 or Gallardo. It may be the best car depending on price/performance issue.

    Yeat it may be slighltly beat all of them but i will be happier and much excited if am in the driving seat of Ferrari, Porsche, Lamborghini. And i think there are a lot of people thinking like me....

    And i am sure there are many vette drivers want to be in Ferrari or Porsche's driver seat but i dont think there are many F,P,L drivers want to be in vette's driver seat than their cars.



    Whoever asked why these always turn into pissing contests, the above statement is exactly why.

    For the sake of argument I'll just level it out there...every car company puts its best foot forward when it comes to stats, times and drivers. Yes the Z06 ran using runflats and no the TT didn't but in the end who cares. I'm sure the TT would have a slightly worse time with regular tires just like the Z06 would have a slightly better time with performance tires. What does this all mean? Everything equals out in the end and this pissing contest/superiority/inferiority complex needs to end

    Re: sorry Nick - tongue in cheek

    Any car NOT using their original off the show room floor equipment, including tires, should not be in these tests. Otherwise, if a change is made then it should be made to each car. As for the Z06, the runflats were to cut the weight of a spare tire and to attempt to make the best of daily driving and some track; it does not do either perfectly.

    Re: sorry Nick - tongue in cheek

    Quote:
    GForceSS said:
    Any car NOT using their original off the show room floor equipment, including tires, should not be in these tests. Otherwise, if a change is made then it should be made to each car. As for the Z06, the runflats were to cut the weight of a spare tire and to attempt to make the best of daily driving and some track; it does not do either perfectly.



    So does this include adjusting the suspension to the hot lap?

    Re: sorry Nick - tongue in cheek

    nBerry, why are you even here? Your 430 couldn't even sniff either the Z06's or the 997TT's exhaust. Its funny how you degrade the 997 but the 430 can't even hang with the TT. I think you're trying to make yourself feel better?

    Re: sorry Nick - tongue in cheek

    Quote:
    Texas911 said:
    nBerry, why are you even here? Your 430 couldn't even sniff either the Z06's or the 997TT's exhaust. Its funny how you degrade the 997 but the 430 can't even hang with the TT. I think you're trying to make yourself feel better?



    Well, you've realized this early !

    Re: sorry Nick - tongue in cheek

    nBerry,
    how many miles have put on your 430 after so much negative posts on a porsche forum

    Re: sorry Nick - tongue in cheek

    Quote:
    GForceSS said:
    Any car NOT using their original off the show room floor equipment, including tires, should not be in these tests. Otherwise, if a change is made then it should be made to each car. As for the Z06, the runflats were to cut the weight of a spare tire and to attempt to make the best of daily driving and some track; it does not do either perfectly.



    You can actually get the Turbo with the MPSC tyres. One thing to note is that these tyres are not true MPSC (they are designed with many more compromises in order to be suitable for daily driving). Also, the 7:43 lap of the Z06 is a flying lap. Add at least 5 seconds to it to get an accurate lap time.

    To disprove Nick's statements, the Corvette is only faster from 100-150 mph. After that, the Turbo reels it in and hard at that (it's 3 seconds quicker from 155 to 185 mph).

    Re: sorry Nick - tongue in cheek

    Quote:
    thuggy said:
    Quote:
    GForceSS said:
    Any car NOT using their original off the show room floor equipment, including tires, should not be in these tests. Otherwise, if a change is made then it should be made to each car. As for the Z06, the runflats were to cut the weight of a spare tire and to attempt to make the best of daily driving and some track; it does not do either perfectly.



    So does this include adjusting the suspension to the hot lap?



    My personal opinion, adjustments are not changing any "physical" parts of the car, so if it has adjustable suspension that's fine (some cars the ECU controls the suspension). Otherwise in this case, just as putting slicks on the P car for the track and racing the runflat Z06 is BS, so is taking a Z06 and putting slicks on it at a drag race, racing a P car, then saying "oh see my car is better or faster". Like-for-like. A modified car is a modified car, not stock from the factory and we all know that the Mod war is never ending, it goes as deep as your pockets allow.

    Re: sorry Nick - tongue in cheek

    Quote:
    Crash said:
    Quote:
    GForceSS said:
    Any car NOT using their original off the show room floor equipment, including tires, should not be in these tests. Otherwise, if a change is made then it should be made to each car. As for the Z06, the runflats were to cut the weight of a spare tire and to attempt to make the best of daily driving and some track; it does not do either perfectly.



    You can actually get the Turbo with the MPSC tyres. One thing to note is that these tyres are not true MPSC (they are designed with many more compromises in order to be suitable for daily driving). Also, the 7:43 lap of the Z06 is a flying lap. Add at least 5 seconds to it to get an accurate lap time.

    To disprove Nick's statements, the Corvette is only faster from 100-150 mph. After that, the Turbo reels it in and hard at that (it's 3 seconds quicker from 155 to 185 mph).



    I don't think anyone can say definitively. There are videos and specs (magazine tests, auto show tests, etc) floating around that disproves your statement. Although I don't like 1/4 mile in these types of discussions, which car has the higher trap speed and better time? That would cover the first 120+mph and which car is in front. Let's say your right about 155 to 185mph, what happens after that? What about the first 0 - 155 mph? Please know the difference between "quick" and "fast", they have their places.

    Reference
    - Swedish magazine Auto Motor Sport
    - Motor trend Z06 Times http://www.motortrend.com/roadtests/coupe/112_0612_2006_sport_coupe_comparison/performance.html
    - Motor Trend more and different Z06 stats http://www.motortrend.com/roadtests/luxu..._911_specs.html

    - Car & Driver Z06 vs Porsche from 0-150mph http://www.caranddriver.com/comparisons/11327/2006-chevrolet-corvette-z06.html




    Please don't just pick which ever one suites your wants, there are more articles showing the huge ranges, so stop reaching for your 1 quote and adding your "facts". There are no absolute facts it seems, just a range of times for every test and these cars are too close to keep having people reach for some article hoping for a second or a tenth of a second. Just drive your car and enjoy it for what it is, if you really really need to justify your purchase (Z06 or 997 T) then go buy both and you be the tester instead of 20 magazines. Then let us know what you find, that to me has more credibility.

    Re: sorry Nick - tongue in cheek

    Quote:
    Just drive your car and enjoy it for what it is, if you really really need to justify your purchase (Z06 or 997 T) then go buy both and you be the tester instead of 20 magazines. Then let us know what you find, that to me has more credibility



    You mean like the guy who just posted that he has both and says the TT is faster?

    Re: sorry Nick - tongue in cheek

    there is another guy on corvetteforum that has both and he says the Z is faster...who's right?

    Crash, where did you get your info that the Z06 lap was a flying one and the TT's was not? I've never heard any mention in Top Gear or any publication stating that fact, just curious really.

    Re: sorry Nick - tongue in cheek

    Why are these cars being compared? the TT should, technically not be compared as its a 4 seat car; beyond that it is the LUXURY top model, if you use the Z, you must accept that P cars are more expensive and compare to the GT2....

    Re: sorry Nick - tongue in cheek

    Quote:
    bondmid003 said:
    there is another guy on corvetteforum that has both and he says the Z is faster...who's right?




    The two contradicting statements point to the (simple) truth: both cars are pretty much identical as far as performance is concerned. Any performance differences seem to be marginal

    Thus, no need for heated discussions. Very similar performance, different prices, different product quality. Everybody may pick whatever he or her prefers

    Re: Well yeehaw and golleee.

    Quote:
    nberry said:
    Quote:
    twinturbo001 said:
    I own both cars a 07Z and a 997TT and there is no comparison the TT is a far better car.



    I assume you bought the TT for all around performance. The Z06 beats it in every performance category.

    If you paid an additional $70,000 for the Porsche name I ask you where is the value? The 997TT will depreciate faster than the Z06.

    If quality is what your referring to I have no doubt the Z06 longevity will be as good if not better than the TT.

    If tracking the car is a consideration then I am puzzled. Porsche voids the warranty for tracking and GM does not.

    Now why is the 997TT a far better car?


    Do you own Either car?? If you do like I do then you understand why I made the comments I did, If you don't then you've read too many Magazines. The Z06 is a Bitch to launch my TIP TT will smoke it out of the hole its not until 100 MPH that the Z catches up. The fit and Finish on the TT is so much better then the Z its not a comparison. The technology of the TT is also far better and you can drive the TT in any conditions rain Snow ETC. The roofs haven't flown Off the TT like the 06Z. Theres also a problem with the Z06 clutch(I experienced this first hand) sometimes the Clutch won't come off the floor when you heat it up. Quality wise the TT is far better quality and if you happen to read any quality reports on Porsche you would know that the Porsche Rivals Lexus for Quality, GM has twice as many Warranty claims as Porsche. Any More questions?

    Re: sorry Nick - tongue in cheek

    Quote:
    nberry said:
    Quote:
    Alan(NJ) said:
    I assume you bought the 430 for all around performance. The Z06 beats it in every performance category.

    If you paid an additional $170,000 for the Ferrari name I ask you where is the value? The 430 will depreciate faster than the Z06 (sic - if the Ferrari is driven).

    If quality is what your referring to I have no doubt the Z06 longevity will be as good if not better than the 430.

    If tracking the car is a consideration then I am puzzled. Ferrari voids the warranty for tracking and GM does not.

    Now why is the Ferrari a far better car?



    The car does not cost me one cent to own.

    Ferrari does not void the warranty for track work.

    It provides a driving experience experienced by very few because of its exclusivity.

    Yet, the 430 IS NOT a far better car.


    Whats exclusive about a F430(Slug) I see more 360/430's then I do Z06's here. The F430 is Dinosaur it needs a complete Redo.

    Re: sorry Nick - tongue in cheek

    Quote:
    twinturbo001 said:
    Quote:
    nberry said:
    Quote:
    Alan(NJ) said:
    I assume you bought the 430 for all around performance. The Z06 beats it in every performance category.

    If you paid an additional $170,000 for the Ferrari name I ask you where is the value? The 430 will depreciate faster than the Z06 (sic - if the Ferrari is driven).

    If quality is what your referring to I have no doubt the Z06 longevity will be as good if not better than the 430.

    If tracking the car is a consideration then I am puzzled. Ferrari voids the warranty for tracking and GM does not.

    Now why is the Ferrari a far better car?



    The car does not cost me one cent to own.

    Ferrari does not void the warranty for track work.

    It provides a driving experience experienced by very few because of its exclusivity.

    Yet, the 430 IS NOT a far better car.


    Whats exclusive about a F430(Slug) I see more 360/430's then I do Z06's here. The F430 is Dinosaur it needs a complete Redo.



    Where's 'here'?

    Re: Well yeehaw and golleee.

    Gentlemen, I'm not going to get caught up in this rivalry between the 997TT and the Z06. However, my simplistic understanding of the comparison FWIW is that the Z06 offers a lot of performance for the price paid BUT that the 997TT is a far better car when judging it on a wider range of criteria.

    Everything in my life experience thus far has always confirmed to me the basic, axiomatic truth that, give or take a few dollars, you basically get what you pay for.

    Re: Well yeehaw and golleee.

    Quote:
    easy_rider911 said:
    Gentlemen, I'm not going to get caught up in this rivalry between the 997TT and the Z06. However, my simplistic understanding of the comparison FWIW is that the Z06 offers a lot of performance for the price paid BUT that the 997TT is a far better car when judging it on a wider range of criteria.

    Everything in my life experience thus far has always confirmed to me the basic, axiomatic truth that, give or take a few dollars, you basically get what you pay for.



    What you say makes perfect sense. The extra money spent gets more features and a not-insignificant aura-touch of the original Porsche zeitgeist.

    Sometimes one's own intrapsychic conflicts, when brought to the party, obscure this truth.


    Re: sorry Nick - tongue in cheek

    Quote:
    MKSGR said:
    Quote:
    bondmid003 said:
    there is another guy on corvetteforum that has both and he says the Z is faster...who's right?




    The two contradicting statements point to the (simple) truth: both cars are pretty much identical as far as performance is concerned. Any performance differences seem to be marginal

    Thus, no need for heated discussions. Very similar performance, different prices, different product quality. Everybody may pick whatever he or her prefers



    MKSGR, you are a voice of reason in a sea of madness

    Re: sorry Nick - tongue in cheek

    Quote:
    SoCal Alan said:
    Quote:
    twinturbo001 said:
    Quote:
    nberry said:
    Quote:
    Alan(NJ) said:
    I assume you bought the 430 for all around performance. The Z06 beats it in every performance category.

    If you paid an additional $170,000 for the Ferrari name I ask you where is the value? The 430 will depreciate faster than the Z06 (sic - if the Ferrari is driven).

    If quality is what your referring to I have no doubt the Z06 longevity will be as good if not better than the 430.

    If tracking the car is a consideration then I am puzzled. Ferrari voids the warranty for tracking and GM does not.

    Now why is the Ferrari a far better car?



    The car does not cost me one cent to own.

    Ferrari does not void the warranty for track work.

    It provides a driving experience experienced by very few because of its exclusivity.

    Yet, the 430 IS NOT a far better car.


    Whats exclusive about a F430(Slug) I see more 360/430's then I do Z06's here. The F430 is Dinosaur it needs a complete Redo.



    Where's 'here'?


    California. I saw a F430 spyder yesterday.

    Re: sorry Nick - tongue in cheek

    What's ironic is that the Z06 is probably more reliable than a 430.

    Re: sorry Nick - tongue in cheek

    There are so many of both of these cars on the road , old and new versions ....that ...I'm....ZZZZZZzzzzzzzz. In a couple years , both will have been superceded and these will be yet another in a decades -old long line of used cars forgotten by anyone on this board.
    Maybe better to buy and tuck away cars that came and went in a short time , like Carrera GT, Ford GT, F40 , etc. They will FOREVER be " youthful " , like a person who dies young .

    Re: sorry Nick - tongue in cheek

    What I'd really like to know is, why is it whenever someone brings up a thread comparing the Z06, F430, 997TT, etc on any of the forums, it quickly becomes a "pissing" contest. Folks just LOVE to add to the fire everywhere I go. I avoid doing that because I know exactly where it will go.

    As for my opinions, I have none. I bought the 997TT because I wanted it. Others buy the Z06 or the F430 because they want it. Life doesn't always have to be all about which is better than the other. There's more to life than that. Okay, I'm getting off my soapbox now. We're all car enthusiasts here, right guys?

     
    Edit

    Forum

    Board Subject Last post Rating Views Replies
    Porsche Sticky OFFICIAL: New 991.2 GT3 (2017) 11/15/18 10:20 AM
    TB993tt
    402477 5188
    Porsche Sticky SUN'S LAST RUN TO WILSON, WY - 991 C2S CAB LIFE, END OF AN ERA 11/17/18 12:03 AM
    Pilot
    320163 1966
    Porsche Sticky 992 (Next 911 generation 2019/2020) 11/17/18 2:17 AM
    Wonderbar
    267997 2959
    Porsche Sticky The moment I've been waiting for... 11/7/18 2:43 PM
    Pilot
     
     
     
     
     
    211100 1077
    Porsche Sticky OFFICIAL: 911 GT2 RS (2017) 11/15/18 6:23 PM
    BONES
    190389 2674
    Porsche Sticky OFFICIAL: 991.2 GT3 RS (2018) 11/17/18 4:56 AM
    ZahirD
    121244 2401
    AMG Sticky Mercedes E63 S AMG (2018) - Short Review (updated on a regular basis) 11/15/18 12:15 PM
    RCA
    32022 316
    Porsche Sticky Paint protection film 9/25/18 6:14 PM
    throt
    13960 121
    Porsche Sticky Child seats in a 991 6/18/18 8:51 PM
    Monkey
    13270 31
    Porsche 991 GT3 RS 1/9/18 1:43 PM
    Kimi
    522534 5816
    Porsche OFFICIAL: 991 Turbo and Turbo S 4/3/18 9:15 AM
    KresoF1
    483188 4254
    Porsche OFFICIAL: 911 R (2016) 9/13/18 10:12 AM
    RCA
    278496 2589
    Porsche Cayman GT4 11/16/18 11:30 AM
    RCA
    263490 2611
    Porsche OFFICIAL: New 991.2 Turbo and Turbo S 1/23/18 12:27 AM
    RCA
    191431 1074
    Ferrari 488 GTB/GTS 11/17/18 4:47 AM
    koko
    189267 1738
    McLaren McLaren on a winning streak 10/29/18 5:13 PM
    reginos
    178528 3212
    Porsche Boxster Spyder (981) 8/31/18 10:25 AM
    WAY
    142665 757
    Others Audi R8 V10 Plus (2016 model) - Review (updated Feb 13th 2017) 11/1/18 6:13 PM
    Boxster Coupe GTS
    141689 2234
    Porsche OFFICIAL: New Panamera (2016) 1/6/18 10:41 PM
    Wonderbar
    128176 1284
    Ferrari Ferrari F12 Berlinetta / 599 GTO Successor 5/22/18 9:16 PM
    RCA
    111577 789
    Others VW caught cheating emissions tests 5/3/18 7:52 PM
    CGX car nut
    106447 871
    Porsche Porsche Mission E - the future of Porsche? 11/6/18 12:58 PM
    RCA
    83998 1119
    Porsche Donor vehicle for Singer Vehicle Design 10/13/18 9:50 PM
    RCA
    66549 672
    Porsche UPDATES: 2018 Porsche Cayenne 2/6/18 2:13 PM
    RCA
    57155 423
    Porsche OFFICIAL: New 991.2 Carrera GTS models 11/3/18 11:09 AM
    bluelines
    46609 477
    Others Tesla Roadster 11/14/18 12:48 PM
    lukestern
    43048 1395
    Others Tesla Model X Thread Closed 2/23/18 3:41 PM
    RCA
    42801 1122
    AMG AMG GT R 1/26/18 7:19 AM
    GoHardGT3RS
    41232 597
    Lambo Aventador and SV 11/16/18 9:46 PM
    Topspeed
    39104 471
    Porsche OFFICIAL: New 991.2 Turbo S Exclusive Series (2017) 11/14/18 11:25 AM
    RCA
    39008 637
    287 items found, displaying 1 to 30.