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    Re: sorry Nick - tongue in cheek


    I guess i have to repost my original post again:


    I don't think anyone can say definitively. There are videos and specs (magazine tests, auto show tests, etc) floating around that disproves your statement. Although I don't like 1/4 mile in these types of discussions, which car has the higher trap speed and better time? That would cover the first 120+mph and which car is in front. Let's say your right about 155 to 185mph, what happens after that? What about the first 0 - 155 mph? Please know the difference between "quick" and "fast", they have their places.

    Reference
    - Swedish magazine Auto Motor Sport

    - Motor trend Z06 Times http://www.motortrend.com/roadtests/coupe/112_0612_2006_sport_coupe_comparison/performance.html

    - Motor Trend more and different Z06 stats http://www.motortrend.com/roadtests/luxu..._911_specs.html

    - Car & Driver Z06 vs Porsche from 0-150mph http://www.caranddriver.com/comparisons/11327/2006-chevrolet-corvette-z06.html

    (want more just ask)


    Please don't just pick which ever one suites your wants, there are more articles showing the huge ranges, so stop reaching for your 1 quote and adding your "facts". There are no absolute facts it seems, just a range of times for every test and these cars are too close to keep having people reach for some article hoping for a second or a tenth of a second. Just drive your car and enjoy it for what it is, if you really really need to justify your purchase (Z06 or 997 T) then go buy both and you be the tester instead of 20 magazines. Then let us know what you find, that to me has more credibility.

    Re: sorry Nick - tongue in cheek

    Quote:
    GForceSS said:

    I guess i have to repost my original post again:


    I don't think anyone can say definitively. There are videos and specs (magazine tests, auto show tests, etc) floating around that disproves your statement. Although I don't like 1/4 mile in these types of discussions, which car has the higher trap speed and better time? That would cover the first 120+mph and which car is in front. Let's say your right about 155 to 185mph, what happens after that? What about the first 0 - 155 mph? Please know the difference between "quick" and "fast", they have their places.

    Reference
    - Swedish magazine Auto Motor Sport

    - Motor trend Z06 Times http://www.motortrend.com/roadtests/coupe/112_0612_2006_sport_coupe_comparison/performance.html

    - Motor Trend more and different Z06 stats http://www.motortrend.com/roadtests/luxu..._911_specs.html

    - Car & Driver Z06 vs Porsche from 0-150mph http://www.caranddriver.com/comparisons/11327/2006-chevrolet-corvette-z06.html

    (want more just ask)


    Please don't just pick which ever one suites your wants, there are more articles showing the huge ranges, so stop reaching for your 1 quote and adding your "facts". There are no absolute facts it seems, just a range of times for every test and these cars are too close to keep having people reach for some article hoping for a second or a tenth of a second. Just drive your car and enjoy it for what it is, if you really really need to justify your purchase (Z06 or 997 T) then go buy both and you be the tester instead of 20 magazines. Then let us know what you find, that to me has more credibility.



    GforceSS, not ONCE have I denied the Z06 being faster up to 155 mph. It IS faster and that's a fact. The above 155 mph comments, like I've said, come from two different sources, one of them being RC, the board owner.

    The C&D test just proves what I'm saying, IMO. The car tested is equally fast as the one in the AMS Nardo test (very fast 0-150 mph time, with the Turbo losing it at 120 mph). They just didn't test it up to 185 mph. In light of there not being other proof, I'll stick with what AMS and RC have said (as there aren't any other sources).

    Btw, the source I picked is arguably the most credible car magazine in the world.

    Re: sorry Nick - tongue in cheek

    " In any case, have you driven a Z06 against a 997TT up to 300 km/h?"

    Nope, but I have from 40-160, and it wasn't even close, just like the video showed.

    "The test up to 180 was NOT done in the wet"

    Really?? Do your HW next time before you look foolish:
    http://www.need4speed.ws/Bugatti-Veyron-400-kmh.html

    "How would a mildly wet road surface negatively affect traction at 150+ mph? It's a Z06 you're talking about, not a Heffner-supercharged Viper."

    It's before 150 where the problem with traction would occur much more so with a rwd car than an AWD car. Is that so hard to understand? Want me to explain simply physics?

    "I have a test that proves that it only does 308 km/h"

    And here is the test when it hit 320 Km/h? Your point?
    http://img170.imageshack.us/my.php?image=testns2.jpg

    "Here are the figures from the Auto Motor und Sport Nardo Speed Test"

    Yup, and according to this test, it did 0-100 in 7.6, your point, AGAIN?
    http://www.motortrend.com/roadtests/coupe/112_0512_exotic_sport_coupes_comparison/specs_price.html


    If telling yourself that the 997 TT is faster from 155-180 makes you feel better because of one test in that was conducted in the rain, then be it. But, just remember two things:

    1) Even in the rain (Probably the ONLY occasion where the TT would be faster to 180) at 190, the Z06 will be saying bye bye to the Porsche as the Porsche gets to its top speed.

    2) I live in the USA. I will be lucky to get races to 135 on publuc highways, never mind 160 or 180.

    Bye bye now, take care, and watch out for the Z06. It will bite..;)

    Re: sorry Nick - tongue in cheek

    Quote:
    Crash said:
    Quote:
    GForceSS said:

    I guess i have to repost my original post again:


    I don't think anyone can say definitively. There are videos and specs (magazine tests, auto show tests, etc) floating around that disproves your statement. Although I don't like 1/4 mile in these types of discussions, which car has the higher trap speed and better time? That would cover the first 120+mph and which car is in front. Let's say your right about 155 to 185mph, what happens after that? What about the first 0 - 155 mph? Please know the difference between "quick" and "fast", they have their places.

    Reference
    - Swedish magazine Auto Motor Sport

    - Motor trend Z06 Times http://www.motortrend.com/roadtests/coupe/112_0612_2006_sport_coupe_comparison/performance.html

    - Motor Trend more and different Z06 stats http://www.motortrend.com/roadtests/luxu..._911_specs.html

    - Car & Driver Z06 vs Porsche from 0-150mph http://www.caranddriver.com/comparisons/11327/2006-chevrolet-corvette-z06.html

    (want more just ask)


    Please don't just pick which ever one suites your wants, there are more articles showing the huge ranges, so stop reaching for your 1 quote and adding your "facts". There are no absolute facts it seems, just a range of times for every test and these cars are too close to keep having people reach for some article hoping for a second or a tenth of a second. Just drive your car and enjoy it for what it is, if you really really need to justify your purchase (Z06 or 997 T) then go buy both and you be the tester instead of 20 magazines. Then let us know what you find, that to me has more credibility.



    GforceSS, not ONCE have I denied the Z06 being faster up to 155 mph. It IS faster and that's a fact. The above 155 mph comments, like I've said, come from two different sources, one of them being RC, the board owner.

    The C&D test just proves what I'm saying, IMO. The car tested is equally fast as the one in the AMS Nardo test (very fast 0-150 mph time, with the Turbo losing it at 120 mph). They just didn't test it up to 185 mph. In light of there not being other proof, I'll stick with what AMS and RC have said (as there aren't any other sources).

    Btw, the source I picked is arguably the most credible car magazine in the world.



    Crash, I hate to point it out to you from your post, but you did deny the Z06 being faster at those speeds. Here is your post:

    [...] "To disprove Nick's statements, the Corvette is only faster from 100-150 mph. After that, the Turbo reels it in and hard at that (it's 3 seconds quicker from 155 to 185 mph)."

    Fadis_z, good research. The more anyone searches the wider the range of times become.

    The George Costanza Complex

    If you have to say you belong or if you have to prove you belong....you usually don't.

    The ZO6 is a great car. The 997TT is a totally different great car.

    ZO6 drivers are consistently on the Porsche forums "proving" that they belong.

    Nothing is worse than a guy who is constantly trying to prove to me that he is good enough (a.k.a. George Costanza...Seinfeld.)

    Re: sorry Nick - tongue in cheek

    As Ron Burgundy would say: "Boy, that escalated quickly... I mean, that really got out of hand fast"

    Alot of people have made some great points but where this debate gets stupid is when people start throwing out words like "cheap", "inferior", "slow", etc to describe the opposition's cars. And this applies to both sides of this argument because I see it from alot of different people.

    And to the guy that used the term "exclusivity" regarding the TT, just don't. You only come across like a snob and this is the same nonsense I see folks on here complaining about from our friends in the "F*****i" community (no offense nberry) I mean can you really say the word exclusive in regards to a car without imagining a guy sticking his pinkey out while sipping coffee from an entirely to small cup?

    2K997TT, this thread was started by a TT owner and trust me none of the Z06 guys here are trying to prove anything, at least I'm sure as heck not. Does mine or your car for that matter really have anything to prove? I don't think so brother

    Re: sorry Nick - tongue in cheek

    What I find interesting is the amount of people who chime in on these Forums and they've never owned the car there talking about. Its nice to read mags or watch videos but its completely different to actually spend Quality time in a car. How many people who have posted on this thread actually own a 997 TT or for that matter have seen the car in person. The only 997 TT I've seen other than my TT is None. There sure are alot of "Experts" who have never owned the car.

    Re: sorry Nick - tongue in cheek

    Ok, well things were going good

    Re: sorry Nick - tongue in cheek


    The 997TT and Z06 are so close that in a street race it would come down to wich driver had the most nerve and got the better traffic gaps to exploit.

    Neither could ever get the other out of its rear view mirror.

    Both are as fast as stabbed rats, so get over it. Choose how much money you want to flush and shut up about it.

    Re: sorry Nick - tongue in cheek

    Quote:
    twinturbo001 said:
    This is Funny really. On a roll I don't know if the Z is faster maybe it is Don't care. Whats going to be really funny is when the 2008 Viper comes out with 615HP and 540 RWHP and spanks everybody including the Z. I am first on the list at my dealer for a 08, its going to be Beautiful to watch Dodge once again walk on everyone(I'm Ecstatic). The 08 Viper will run 10's on street tires not DR's like the Z. No way Dodge would bring out the 08 if it didn't beat the Z. 3 Mags have already tested the 08 Viper against the Z the results will be public soon.



    YUP. theres your bang for the buck, as long as you price in "wow factor"....the viper is the king again, I may well still take the porsche, but for raw disgusting displays of brutal torque....its all dodge ....

    Re: sorry Nick - tongue in cheek

    My take on the Z06. I love it and am glad that GM hasn't abandoned the last remaining true world class sports car from the USA. I'm sure the Corvette is not a money maker for GM. Is it for me, no, but that doesn't mean I can't respect it and respect their owners.

    Re: sorry Nick - tongue in cheek

    Quote:
    Fadis_z said:
    The only time the TT will be close with the C6 Z06 is when racing from a dig UP TO THE 1/4 mile point. That is it. After that, it will get passed. Even within the 1/4, if the Z06 driver is very competent, then the Z06 will win. How many times did you hear about a 997 TT running mid-low 11's stock @124+ mph?

    2

    For sake of completion you should have added that above 150 mph the 997TT is again faster than the Z06 (until the 997TT reaches its top-speed at 310kph).

    Thus, neither car is faster in the entire speed range. The TT is faster at lower speeds (below 100kph) and at high speeds (above 200kph). The Z06 is faster between 100kph and 200kph. Also, any differences are very minor. Bascially, as said above, both cars deliver (practically) identical performance

    Re: sorry Nick - tongue in cheek

    Quote:
    Fadis_z said:
    Quote:
    twinturbo001 said:
    Quote:
    Fadis_z said:

    If you truly have a Z06, then you will know what I am saying is true and is objective. Not just blowing smoke out of my ass. These are facts that are backed up by mags.





    Here are some additional test results (AMS High-speed test):

    Z06 / 997TT

    0-100kph: 4.0s / 3.7s
    0-200kph: 11.9s / 12.3s
    0-250kph: 19.0s / 20.7s
    0-300kph: 41.8s / 40.7s

    As you see: TT faster below 100kph and above 250kph...

    You might also notice that we are talking about differences in the range of 1s or so. Thus, stating that either car has superior performance would be some kind of joke

    If you want superior performance you need to buy another car. No Z06 or 997TT. Simple fact

    Re: sorry Nick - tongue in cheek

    Quote:
    Fadis_z said:
    Quote:
    Crash said:
    Quote:
    Fadis_z said:
    Quote:
    GForceSS said:
    Quote:
    Fadis_z said:
    I am not sure who you are talking about that says the Z06 is the "better" car. I certainly didn't. The Z06 is the quicker/faster car, YES!! Better car? NO!!

    Come on folks, don't let brand loyalty passion blind you from real world facts. I don't (As you can tell).




    Quote:
    SciFrog said:
    Is is not brand loyalty. Porsche just fills a specific market and they are the best at it. That's why they are the most profitable car manufacturer and that's why I own 2 P cars. Something better comes out tomorrow, I'll buy it.



    Stop for a minute and look at both the posts, you are just about saying the same thing...and i agree. Add truth and not opinion and it is amazing how much Z06 owners and P 997 T owners DO agree.

    I did love the IKEA example though



    I wish i can say that I agree, but I don't. Even when the truth is spoken, some Porsche owners just don't want to believe it, and vice versa. We all want to be the best, and always defend out beloved cars, but I for one like to keep an open mind and stay objective. I just think passion blinds many out of the real world facts. It is hard to come acorss one that is open minded, not biased, and says it like it is.

    How many Porsche owners will come out and admit that the Z06 is the faster/quicker car? How many Vet owenrs will come out and admit that the Porsche is the better car? I bet you not many at all due to the reasons I stated above.

    It is just the way the world works, and sometimes it is sad. Oh well.



    For all your talk of Porsche drivers being blinded by brand loyalty, you sound surprisingly close-minded .

    No, nobody here will admit that the Z06 is the faster car, but at the same time we will all admit that the Z06 is the faster car.

    How so?

    The Porsche is faster up to around 100 mph as you've correctly stated, the Z06 then pulls away up to about 155 mph, but then the Porsche reels it in hard.

    Also, regarding top speed, the Corvette has also been tested to do less than 310 km/h and the 997TT to do 315 km/h. Then again, top speed is academic and the Turbo will get to it faster, anyway.

    Of course there is a huge difference between these two cars and their purpose:

    The Turbo is designed to be a comfortable daily driver with all the creature comforts one could want, while being blisteringly fast on rural roads and a blistering performer on the Autobahn. Of course you pay through the nose to get this combination.

    The Z06 on the other hand is designed specifically for the US market, with its strongest points being light weight and awesome mid-range acceleration. Of course it's a much rawer car, but with a 70.000-dollar price tag, it doesn't really try to be anything else.

    Could Porsche improve the mid range performance? Absolutely.
    Could Chevy improve the Vette's top end? Sure.

    They simply chose the setups as they are because they are the most suited to their target audiences.

    GforceSS, the high-speed performance argument was only confirmed by the Nardo speed test. RC had reported it several months earlier (he actually raced one several times to high 3-figure speeds).

    And the MPSC tires CAN be had with a new Turbo, that's the reason it's limited to 310 km/h (as stated by RC).

    Simply put, both cars have merit for their respectful purposes. That's it.



    It reels it in hard after 155? The TT is faster to 100?
    LOL..Ok, if you say so.

    1) The Z06's 4th gear goes to 160 - FACT
    2) That test that the Z06 posted a slower time to 180 than teh TT was done in the WET. Would the wet roads have more of an effect on a rwd car than an AWD car? Of course - FACT
    3) Z06 has recorded a 0-100 in 7.6 secs - FACT
    what has the TT done?
    4) Z06 has been tested in a recent mag and recorded a top speed of 320 km/h - FACT
    What has the TT done??

    Let me know if you want any links to the above documents.

    i don't care for your opinion, as I am sure you don't care about mine.



    Crash made the right points. His statements are 100% in line with available test results.

    For example: can you post a single test of the Z06 confirming its high-speed (>150mph) performance? No?

    We can. We have magazine test results, videos and tests done by RC for example.

    Please acknowledge that people here do argue on the basis of a certain background knowledge.

    Re: sorry Nick - tongue in cheek

    Quote:
    Fadis_z said:
    And here is the test when it hit 320 Km/h? Your point?
    http://img170.imageshack.us/my.php?image=testns2.jpg




    Your quote is from an earlier AMS test (where they did not test the top-speed but rather quote the factory claim). In a later edition AMS tested the top-speed and came up with 315kph (the number Crash posted above).

    On the other hand, 315kph is still a tad faster than the 311kph (or so) the 997TT is capable of doing

    Re: sorry Nick - tongue in cheek

    Quote:
    MKSGR said:
    Quote:
    Fadis_z said:
    And here is the test when it hit 320 Km/h? Your point?
    http://img170.imageshack.us/my.php?image=testns2.jpg




    Your quote is from an earlier AMS test (where they did not test the top-speed but rather quote the factory claim). In a later edition AMS tested the top-speed and came up with 315kph (the number Crash posted above).

    On the other hand, 315kph is still a tad faster than the 311kph (or so) the 997TT is capable of doing



    A pleasure, as always!

    Markus, I'm starting to believe it's a waste of time arguing with some of these guys, when the answer to my claim of the TT not being faster up to 155 mph is: "But you've said that it reels it in hard after 150 mph!" .

    Let's just forget it. Our test results are worth nothing and theirs are worth their weight in gold .
    In any case, as Fadis the Annihilator has pointed out, he is lucky to reach 135, so he is definitely well qualified to make assumptions about the car's high-speed performance .

    And yes, the 320 km/h figure is a factory claim. So far we've seen 308 and 315 km/h. Then again, I've also seen a Turbo do 315 km/h and none did less than 311 km/h. So, does this mean the Turbo is faster?

    Re: sorry Nick - tongue in cheek

    Crash which mag was the top speed test done 308km/h? Was it Automobilismo or a french mag? I ve seen once 308km/h test result for z06 but couldnt find the mag test again.

    Re: sorry Nick - tongue in cheek

    Quote:
    VGA18 said:
    Crash which mag was the top speed test done 308km/h? Was it Automobilismo or a french mag? I ve seen once 308km/h test result for z06 but couldnt find the mag test again.



    Automobilismo, yes. I think I still have it lying around somewhere. Not sure about a French mag, but if you have a test from there, I'd be glad to see it.

    Re: sorry Nick - tongue in cheek

    Need to check mag at home. I was not sure if it was automobilismo or french mag. But when you say it is A'mobilismo then it is probably A'mobilismo then

    Re: sorry Nick - tongue in cheek

    Quote:
    nberry said:
    Quote:
    Alan(NJ) said:
    I assume you bought the 430 for all around performance. The Z06 beats it in every performance category.

    If you paid an additional $170,000 for the Ferrari name I ask you where is the value? The 430 will depreciate faster than the Z06 (sic - if the Ferrari is driven).

    If quality is what your referring to I have no doubt the Z06 longevity will be as good if not better than the 430.

    If tracking the car is a consideration then I am puzzled. Ferrari voids the warranty for tracking and GM does not.

    Now why is the Ferrari a far better car?



    The car does not cost me one cent to own.






    Nick,

    How can you say that the 430 doesn't cost you one cent to own? Clearly, you had to bow to the F-car God and take it in the pants to even have the opportunity to own the 430. (Eventually, even the 430 WILL depreciate.)

    Cost of ownership should also be measured by maintenance and allowable miles driven. While a 997tt may be mileage sensitive, the 430 is EXTREMELY mileage sensitive. You have to keep the miles at less than 2k per year to have a decent resale. And, that is after paying $5k bi-annually for the mandated servicing.

    So, over the years, even your glorious F-car costs you some bucks! Gorgeous car though.

    Re: sorry Nick - tongue in cheek

    Quote:
    devo said:
    Quote:
    nberry said:
    Quote:
    Alan(NJ) said:
    I assume you bought the 430 for all around performance. The Z06 beats it in every performance category.

    If you paid an additional $170,000 for the Ferrari name I ask you where is the value? The 430 will depreciate faster than the Z06 (sic - if the Ferrari is driven).

    If quality is what your referring to I have no doubt the Z06 longevity will be as good if not better than the 430.

    If tracking the car is a consideration then I am puzzled. Ferrari voids the warranty for tracking and GM does not.

    Now why is the Ferrari a far better car?



    The car does not cost me one cent to own.






    Nick,

    How can you say that the 430 doesn't cost you one cent to own? Clearly, you had to bow to the F-car God and take it in the pants to even have the opportunity to own the 430. (Eventually, even the 430 WILL depreciate.)

    Cost of ownership should also be measured by maintenance and allowable miles driven. While a 997tt may be mileage sensitive, the 430 is EXTREMELY mileage sensitive. You have to keep the miles at less than 2k per year to have a decent resale. And, that is after paying $5k bi-annually for the mandated servicing.

    So, over the years, even your glorious F-car costs you some bucks! Gorgeous car though.



    Devo, I responded to your argument in an earlier post on this thread.

    BTW I took delivery of my 430 Spider on Dec. 3 2005. Today I have 6700 miles on it. The total cost for maintenance has been $1160.00. My car today is worth much more than what I paid for it. The base price of a 430 Spider F1 is $204,000 before options. Today, 430 Spiders are selling anywhere from $275,000 to $300,000.

    This whole argument started because one poster stated that the 997TT is a FAR better car than the Z06. Undoubtedly, the TT is a better car but FAR better?

    Re: sorry Nick - tongue in cheek

    Quote:
    nberry said:
    Quote:
    devo said:
    Quote:
    nberry said:
    Quote:
    Alan(NJ) said:
    I assume you bought the 430 for all around performance. The Z06 beats it in every performance category.

    If you paid an additional $170,000 for the Ferrari name I ask you where is the value? The 430 will depreciate faster than the Z06 (sic - if the Ferrari is driven).

    If quality is what your referring to I have no doubt the Z06 longevity will be as good if not better than the 430.

    If tracking the car is a consideration then I am puzzled. Ferrari voids the warranty for tracking and GM does not.

    Now why is the Ferrari a far better car?



    The car does not cost me one cent to own.






    Nick,

    How can you say that the 430 doesn't cost you one cent to own? Clearly, you had to bow to the F-car God and take it in the pants to even have the opportunity to own the 430. (Eventually, even the 430 WILL depreciate.)

    Cost of ownership should also be measured by maintenance and allowable miles driven. While a 997tt may be mileage sensitive, the 430 is EXTREMELY mileage sensitive. You have to keep the miles at less than 2k per year to have a decent resale. And, that is after paying $5k bi-annually for the mandated servicing.

    So, over the years, even your glorious F-car costs you some bucks! Gorgeous car though.



    Devo, I responded to your argument in an earlier post on this thread.

    BTW I took delivery of my 430 Spider on Dec. 3 2005. Today I have 6700 miles on it. The total cost for maintenance has been $1160.00. My car today is worth much more than what I paid for it. The base price of a 430 Spider F1 is $204,000 before options. Today, 430 Spiders are selling anywhere from $275,000 to $300,000.

    This whole argument started because one poster stated that the 997TT is a FAR better car than the Z06. Undoubtedly, the TT is a better car but FAR better?




    "Far better" is subjective. I could argue the same point. I have no problem saying it, if the cost was the same, I'd pick the 430. (P-fans, go ahead and bash away) However, I don't think that the price difference is worth it for either scenario; Z06-997tt or 997tt-430. I believe that I can honestly say, I don't think there is $60k more performance in the tt nor is there $80k more excitment in the 430. The 430's best attributes are its sex appeal and resale.

    Your numbers seemed a little skewed. Isn't there a bi-annual $5k maintenance requirement? Will a $204,000 base priced 430 Spyder with your type of mileage bring $275,000-$300,000? I'm not trying to argue it; I'm curious. Sorry, if we already had this discussion.

    Re: sorry Nick - tongue in cheek

    I have already stated that the 430 is NOT a FAR better car than the Z06.

    Regarding price difference, I agree it would all depend on what the buyer values.

    Maintenance on the 430 is required at 5000, 15,000 and 30,000. Mine was the 5000 mile. The 15,000 will cost more probably around $4500. The value of my car is close to what I reported. You might quibble over a few thousand but the result is the same. It is worth more than what MSRP was even after a year of ownership.

    Did you sell your 997TT? If so were you able to get MSRP? I am curious because the 997TT still has a reasonable demand for it. I just don't know what a used one would go for.

    Re: sorry Nick - tongue in cheek

    Quote:
    nberry said:
    Quote:
    devo said:
    Quote:
    nberry said:
    Quote:
    Alan(NJ) said:
    I assume you bought the 430 for all around performance. The Z06 beats it in every performance category.

    If you paid an additional $170,000 for the Ferrari name I ask you where is the value? The 430 will depreciate faster than the Z06 (sic - if the Ferrari is driven).

    If quality is what your referring to I have no doubt the Z06 longevity will be as good if not better than the 430.

    If tracking the car is a consideration then I am puzzled. Ferrari voids the warranty for tracking and GM does not.

    Now why is the Ferrari a far better car?



    The car does not cost me one cent to own.






    Nick,

    How can you say that the 430 doesn't cost you one cent to own? Clearly, you had to bow to the F-car God and take it in the pants to even have the opportunity to own the 430. (Eventually, even the 430 WILL depreciate.)

    Cost of ownership should also be measured by maintenance and allowable miles driven. While a 997tt may be mileage sensitive, the 430 is EXTREMELY mileage sensitive. You have to keep the miles at less than 2k per year to have a decent resale. And, that is after paying $5k bi-annually for the mandated servicing.

    So, over the years, even your glorious F-car costs you some bucks! Gorgeous car though.



    Devo, I responded to your argument in an earlier post on this thread.

    BTW I took delivery of my 430 Spider on Dec. 3 2005. Today I have 6700 miles on it. The total cost for maintenance has been $1160.00. My car today is worth much more than what I paid for it. The base price of a 430 Spider F1 is $204,000 before options. Today, 430 Spiders are selling anywhere from $275,000 to $300,000.

    This whole argument started because one poster stated that the 997TT is a FAR better car than the Z06. Undoubtedly, the TT is a better car but FAR better?


    It's not far better until you have to drive it in the rain then it becomes far better...can you say hugely? . Thats what I love about Nick...he always has a balanced commentary when it comes to his favorite subject, that being "997TT". I think everyone agrees these cars are great cars...not the same but nevertheless great in their own right...so now that we got that one out of the way. Nick, what should we argue about next?...I know the subject matter will invariably be about...you guessed it..the 997 Turbo

    Re: sorry Nick - tongue in cheek

    Wow, all these posts still going on.

    It is so hilarious how you guys are SO IN DENIAL, yapping about how the Porsche is faster at 180 due to ONE test IN THE RAIN, yet there is a video on the first page of a Z06 BLOWING away the 997 TT from a 35-170.

    Keep on arguing fellas. You will soon learn that refering back to one test in the rain over and over again is not going to save you in the real world when you get your ass handed to you by a Z06.

    Keep on arguing...

    Re: sorry Nick - tongue in cheek

    Just to show you my objectivity, I will tell I do not drive my 430 in the rain. If it threatens rain, I do not take it out. If I cannot drive it with the top down for any reason, it stays in. I am not certain if the windshield wipers work.

    It is not because the car cannot handle the rain but because I view the car as a diversion and sanctuary for me. A Ferrari, at least to me, is not a workhorse but a reward for hard work and a job well done(sometimes ). It is my toy and adult Disneyland.

    BTW, any AWD drive car is FAR better than a car without AWD in the rain and snow.

    Re: sorry Nick - tongue in cheek

    Yeah what's up with you guys taking your preciouses out in the rain? Kidding, I've driven my Z in the rain two or three times

    Re: sorry Nick - tongue in cheek

    Handling doesnt matter guys. We all dont want to see our cars dirty after rain and also we have daily cars. Also in rain it is higher chance somebody will come and hit or crash you. My car is AWD even i do not drive in the rain also. I think it does not depend on Zz06 or F430 RWD or Gallardo is AWD.

    Re: sorry Nick - tongue in cheek

    Quote:
    Fadis_z said:
    in the real world when you get your ass handed to you by a Z06.





    Not me. I have nothing to prove by street racing a "good value" GM product.

    Re: sorry Nick - tongue in cheek

    MMD do you actually own a 997TT or are you lurking from one of the other boards

    Oh, and thats a real nice boat you're looking at VGA18, not many of our toys can compare with THAT

     
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