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    Re: 997 Turbo - Powerkit

    Power Kit will have between 510-515hp as Christian(RC) already said. His information were always pretty correct IMHO.
    Regarding typo or not in Sport Auto... My friend who works for AMS told me that PK for 997 turbo will have 512hp. So, true or not?
    I do not know yet, but his info is very close to RC's info at beggining of this thread...

    Any way Power Kit will be pretty extensive(some gearbox changes, etc.) and expensive. 3.8L(3746ccm)? I do not know.

    But, how this sound to you:
    512hp/680Nm
    0-100: 3.7s(manual)
    0-200:12.0s(manual)
    Max: 317km/h
    Price: Euro 17000

    Of course, this is just my imagination...

    Re: 997 Turbo - Powerkit

    Quote:
    MKSGR said:
    Quote:
    Crash said:
    Quote:
    MKSGR said:
    Quote:
    Crash said:
    Quote:
    W211 said:
    Quote:
    Dock (Atlanta) said:
    Quote:
    In my books, the quieter the car is, the better as I can do my business, enjoy the music, talk on the phone or with my passenger...



    The louder and more raw my Turbo the better. The music I listen to is the engine/exhaust symphony, I can't talk on the phone because both hands are being used to enjoy the driving experience, and the only sound coming form my passenger is the gasp of air emitted when they experience full boost.

    The Turbo is a sports car, not a luxo-cruiser.



    I guess I'm too shy or timid, I find I can speed much better when I don't get the attention from others, especailly the cops. And I buy these cars to speed.

    I used to like the AMG best, always in the stealth mode, but then, they don't handle well enough.



    They are fast, though.

    E55 138-308 km/h



    Approximately on par with 996TTS or 997GT3 (200-305kph based on speedo, i.e. assuming comparable speedo accuracy)



    You're saying that the 997 GT3 is as fast as the Turbo S?



    Should be Don't you agree?



    Does make sense now that you point it out, I just never really considered the GT3 to be in the same league. So you're saying that it's as fast as the M6 to its top speed? That is awesome performance !

    Re: 997 Turbo - Powerkit

    The GT3 does 310 kph top speed, same as 997 Turbo.
    BUT: as far as I remember, it takes the GT3 more than 30 seconds longer to reach that speed.
    Top speed isn't everything, it also counts how fast you get there.

    Re: 997 Turbo - Powerkit

    Quote:
    RC said:
    The GT3 does 310 kph top speed, same as 997 Turbo.
    BUT: as far as I remember, it takes the GT3 more than 30 seconds longer to reach that speed.
    Top speed isn't everything, it also counts how fast you get there.



    So much longer? I'd have thought that with the lighter weight, better aerodynamics and RWD the GT3 wouldn't have been that much slower - slower yes, but not by such a huge margin. I'd say that this proves that the Turbo probably has more than the stated 480 bhp .

    Re: 997 Turbo - Powerkit

    Quote:
    KresoF1 said:
    Power Kit will have between 510-515hp as Christian(RC) already said. His information were always pretty correct IMHO.
    Regarding typo or not in Sport Auto... My friend who works for AMS told me that PK for 997 turbo will have 512hp. So, true or not?
    I do not know yet, but his info is very close to RC's info at beggining of this thread...

    Any way Power Kit will be pretty extensive(some gearbox changes, etc.) and expensive. 3.8L(3746ccm)? I do not know.

    But, how this sound to you:
    512hp/680Nm
    0-100: 3.7s(manual)
    0-200:12.0s(manual)
    Max: 317km/h
    Price: Euro 17000

    Of course, this is just my imagination...



    Great thread everyone, and thanks for the, um, "rumours," Kreso and RC.

    I would be pleasantly surprised if the powerkit had a 3.8L engine. Of course, a new motor (or at least new cylinders and pistons amongst other hardware) seems to stretch the meaning of the word "kit." It seems rather un-Porsche-like to increase displacement of the TT yet, perhaps not even yet for the 997GT2, since the existing VTG on the 3.6L GT1-based engine can handle a slight bump in max. boost to 1.3 or 1.4 and, consequently, 550 peak HP. And with the GT2's no doubt freer-flowing (and louder ) exhaust, that would easily get one to 530HP, let alone 550.

    And ala the 996TT/PK/S, certainly the gearbox, oil pump and intercoolers could be tweaked and upgraded, as well. I would also welcome a bigger VTG, but as Eclou said, if the PK makes only 30 or so extra ponies, even without a freer flowing exhaust, Porsche would have to limit/detune the car even further-which tuners and enthusiasts like myself wouldn't mind, since a "re-tune" would be fairly easy.

    So I am guessing we will see 3.6L possibly with a modded compressor side of the VTG-or a bigger VTG (although for only 510-515HP, I'm getting more skeptical of this). There could be a tranny mod. to handle the little extra torque/heat, and I wouldn't be surprised if the same (or similar) strangulating exhaust found its way onto the PK, as well.

    I definitely WANT to see 3.8L, bigger VTG's, a freer exhaust, plus gearbox/oil pump/intercooler mods., since that would be a great platform for making 650-700HP. I just don't think it will happen. BUT I am hoping I am dead-wrong.

    On the question of a retrofit, RC's statement that "...there is also a very good chance that the PK will NOT be retrofittable..." doesn't necessarily mean to me that the engine will be 3.8L or that the VTG will be bigger, just a slightly modded tranny alone could achieve that restriction.

    I hope Porsche surprises me/us on the PK, and this will clarify when I will order a 997TT.

    Re: 997 Turbo - Powerkit

    Quote:
    Turbo Al said:
    On the question of a retrofit, RC's statement that "...there is also a very good chance that the PK will NOT be retrofittable..." doesn't necessarily mean to me that the engine will be 3.8L or that the VTG will be bigger, just a slightly modded tranny alone could achieve that restriction.




    Well I lose my warrantee if I retrofit a X51 to my June '05 built 997 C2S Cab! Porsche Germany say unofficially it would be fine, they just can't certify it as the Powerkit came out 2 months later than my car was built.

    So perhaps the new Turbo Powerkit *could* be retrofitted even if Porsche say no, which therefore doesn't necessarily suggest major changes in the base car to accommodate it.

    Re: 997 Turbo - Powerkit

    Quote:
    RC said:
    The GT3 does 310 kph top speed, same as 997 Turbo.
    BUT: as far as I remember, it takes the GT3 more than 30 seconds longer to reach that speed.
    Top speed isn't everything, it also counts how fast you get there.



    Based on speedo indication the 200-305kph time of the 997TT is around 22-23s, the 997GT3 does 200-305 in around 28-29s (based on two videos I have seen)

    Re: 997 Turbo - Powerkit

    Quote:
    MKSGR said:
    Quote:
    RC said:
    The GT3 does 310 kph top speed, same as 997 Turbo.
    BUT: as far as I remember, it takes the GT3 more than 30 seconds longer to reach that speed.
    Top speed isn't everything, it also counts how fast you get there.



    Based on speedo indication the 200-305kph time of the 997TT is around 22-23s, the 997GT3 does 200-305 in around 28-29s (based on two videos I have seen)



    And since the 997GT3/GT3RS does 0-200kph in 13.3-13.4s, and the 997TT manual/TipS does it in 12.8/12.2, that's at least 8-10s more time for the GT3/GT3RS to go 0-300kph versus the 997TT (manual/TipS).

    Re: 997 Turbo - Powerkit

    Quote:
    Alex (UK) said:
    Quote:
    Turbo Al said:
    On the question of a retrofit, RC's statement that "...there is also a very good chance that the PK will NOT be retrofittable..." doesn't necessarily mean to me that the engine will be 3.8L or that the VTG will be bigger, just a slightly modded tranny alone could achieve that restriction.




    Well I lose my warrantee if I retrofit a X51 to my June '05 built 997 C2S Cab! Porsche Germany say unofficially it would be fine, they just can't certify it as the Powerkit came out 2 months later than my car was built.

    So perhaps the new Turbo Powerkit *could* be retrofitted even if Porsche say no, which therefore doesn't necessarily suggest major changes in the base car to accommodate it.



    Good point, Alex,

    Lack of "retrofitness" could be mechanical or merely official (per PAG).

    Re: 997 Turbo - Powerkit

    Quote:
    Dock (Atlanta) said:
    "...and the only sound coming from my passenger is the gasp of air emitted when they experience full boost."




    Re: 997 Turbo - Powerkit

    IMO, P engineers are lagging far behind their more industrious counterparts at F/MB....

    Where's the ever-delayed PDK???? Will PDK 1.0 be as primitive as F1 1.0 of 10+ yrs ago?...or as inept as PCCB 1.0???

    Why can't P engineers come up w/a competent (and profitable)$5K PSE option for 997TT??? Even elder-statesmen cars like 599 and 65 have elegantly intimidating exhaust notes despite inherently smooth V12s and/or biturbos muffling the note...(recall how awful the 575 sounded? F hated to see Tubi capture the profits of aftermkt exhausts....and F clearly solved the issue w/its 599 exhaust note "engineering" )

    And will PK still have the awful, confidence-sapping turbo lag? Why do turbo 600/65 motors lack noticeable turbo lag, despite lacking allegedly super-duper VTGs???

    Re: 997 Turbo - Powerkit

    VK - The 600/65 engines have both more displacement and more cylinders to start with, hence the less initial lag.

    I dont think the 997TT's lag is "confidence sapping" its not bad at all. Turbo PSE for 5K? Lots of options for that now from AWE, Fabspeed and others.

    Got PDK blues? Notice that the F1 and Duo clutch packs in Ferraris and Maseratis hardly meet Porsche durability standards.They wont even warranty them from new and a owner needs a Papal blessing to get 10,000 miles of life from one.

    Powerkits - who here is actually that skilled to extract ALL of whats in their TT now? See any Carrera Cup or LeMans pilots posting here.


    Re: 997 Turbo - Powerkit

    Quote:
    VKSF said:
    IMO, P engineers are lagging far behind their more industrious counterparts at F/MB....

    Where's the ever-delayed PDK???? Will PDK 1.0 be as primitive as F1 1.0 of 10+ yrs ago?...or as inept as PCCB 1.0???

    Why can't P engineers come up w/a competent (and profitable)$5K PSE option for 997TT??? Even elder-statesmen cars like 599 and 65 have elegantly intimidating exhaust notes despite inherently smooth V12s and/or biturbos muffling the note...(recall how awful the 575 sounded? F hated to see Tubi capture the profits of aftermkt exhausts....and F clearly solved the issue w/its 599 exhaust note "engineering" )

    And will PK still have the awful, confidence-sapping turbo lag? Why do turbo 600/65 motors lack noticeable turbo lag, despite lacking allegedly super-duper VTGs???



    imo you are truly missing the Porsche philosophy:

    progressive product launches with incremental performance enhances (997TT-->PK-->PDK-->TTS-->GT2-->ETC...)

    This is why the performance parameters are "confined" to 30 hp etc... not for mechanical reliability et al. Let's be serious, the PK could easily achieve 50-60hp+ but that wouldn't exactly bode well for the "product line".

    With that being said, let's wait for final specs (Kreso/RCish if you will ) before truly getting into the nitty gritty...

    Re: 997 Turbo - Powerkit

    Quote:
    Hurst said:
    imo you are truly missing the Porsche philosophy:

    progressive product launches with incremental performance enhances (997TT-->PK-->PDK-->TTS-->GT2-->ETC...)

    This is why the performance parameters are "confined" to 30 hp etc... not for mechanical reliability et al. Let's be serious, the PK could easily achieve 50-60hp+ but that wouldn't exactly bode well for the "product line".



    Agreed. Porsche is the most profitable per unit manufacturer for a reason. It makes sense also that you don't release 997TT v1 followed by v2 12 months later with an added 80hp. All the v1 owners would be pretty miffed and then the market is flooded with v1 cars which plummet in value. Then the cycle of depreciation dives deeper as v2 and v3 are released

    Re: 997 Turbo - Powerkit

    Quote:
    KresoF1 said:
    But, how this sound to you:
    512hp/680Nm
    0-100: 3.7s(manual)
    0-200:12.0s(manual)
    Max: 317km/h
    Price: Euro 17000



    How does it sound? That sounds like an awful lot of money for what you get.

    Re: 997 Turbo - Powerkit

    Quote:
    Rossi said:
    Quote:
    KresoF1 said:
    But, how this sound to you:
    512hp/680Nm
    0-100: 3.7s(manual)
    0-200:12.0s(manual)
    Max: 317km/h
    Price: Euro 17000



    How does it sound? That sounds like an awful lot of money for what you get.



    If those 12 seconds actually equal 11 in the real world, then it's worth the price. Also, you'd expect a real 320 km/h, not some number that barely equals the 430 and the Gallardo.

    Re: 997 Turbo - Powerkit

    Quote:
    Crash said:
    Quote:
    Rossi said:
    Quote:
    KresoF1 said:
    But, how this sound to you:
    512hp/680Nm
    0-100: 3.7s(manual)
    0-200:12.0s(manual)
    Max: 317km/h
    Price: Euro 17000



    How does it sound? That sounds like an awful lot of money for what you get.



    If those 12 seconds actually equal 11 in the real world, then it's worth the price. Also, you'd expect a real 320 km/h, not some number that barely equals the 430 and the Gallardo.



    11 seconds for nil to twohundred in a turbo with only 512 hp is wishful thinking.

    Re: 997 Turbo - Powerkit

    Quote:
    VKSF said:Why do turbo 600/65 motors lack noticeable turbo lag, despite lacking allegedly super-duper VTGs???



    Simply put, the 600/65 are poorly balanced cars. Of course, it's easy to put a heavy big displacement engine at the expense of vehicle dynamics.

    If you only do straight lines on highways, 600/65 are fine but look at their weight and lack of traction, there is a reason why they handle so poorly.

    I don't know what is more annoying - turbo lag on the 997TT below 3k rpm or traction control randomly cutting off power on the 600/65. At least with the 997TT, I can keep the rev up but the 600/65, the lack of traction is certainly confidence sapping.

    Re: 997 Turbo - Powerkit

    Quote:
    Crash said:
    Also, you'd expect a real 320 km/h, not some number that barely equals the 430 and the Gallardo.



    top speed is pure fantasy. I bet 1 in 100 will ever attempt it

    Re: 997 Turbo - Powerkit

    Quote:
    eclou said:
    Quote:
    Crash said:
    Also, you'd expect a real 320 km/h, not some number that barely equals the 430 and the Gallardo.



    top speed is pure fantasy. I bet 1 in 100 will ever attempt it



    I will. Did with every car I've ever driven. Then again, I'm sure you're right about the US, where you'd go straight to jail .

    Re: 997 Turbo - Powerkit

    Quote:
    Crash said:
    Quote:
    eclou said:
    Quote:
    Crash said:
    Also, you'd expect a real 320 km/h, not some number that barely equals the 430 and the Gallardo.



    top speed is pure fantasy. I bet 1 in 100 will ever attempt it



    I will. Did with every car I've ever driven. Then again, I'm sure you're right about the US, where you'd go straight to jail .



    Topspeed nowadays is a useless waste-product of the ever increasing power figures. What does it mean if a car can reach 299 or 300 as a top speed? Or if it can go 330 kph instead?

    Important is the way up there and how else it performs.

    Re: 997 Turbo - Powerkit

    Quote:
    Rossi said:
    Quote:
    Crash said:
    Quote:
    eclou said:
    Quote:
    Crash said:
    Also, you'd expect a real 320 km/h, not some number that barely equals the 430 and the Gallardo.



    top speed is pure fantasy. I bet 1 in 100 will ever attempt it



    I will. Did with every car I've ever driven. Then again, I'm sure you're right about the US, where you'd go straight to jail .



    Topspeed nowadays is a useless waste-product of the ever increasing power figures. What does it mean if a car can reach 299 or 300 as a top speed? Or if it can go 330 kph instead?

    Important is the way up there and how else it performs.



    I agree. Makes for good bragging rights if it does 330 though, doesn't it?

    Re: 997 Turbo - Powerkit

    The arguments in this thread are a waste of time unless you are a Turbo newbie . Just read the thousands of factory powerkit vs aftermkt modding pros/cons on the prev 996 Turbo on this and the many other Turbo boards .In fact , those " other " boards are way more into Turbo mod talk than this one , which generally discusses factory product , which is why it's more civil here with fewer " pissing contests" . Same old, same old, really.

    Re: 997 Turbo - Powerkit

    Quote:
    Crash said:
    Quote:
    Rossi said:
    Quote:
    Crash said:
    Quote:
    eclou said:
    Quote:
    Crash said:
    Also, you'd expect a real 320 km/h, not some number that barely equals the 430 and the Gallardo.



    top speed is pure fantasy. I bet 1 in 100 will ever attempt it



    I will. Did with every car I've ever driven. Then again, I'm sure you're right about the US, where you'd go straight to jail .



    Topspeed nowadays is a useless waste-product of the ever increasing power figures. What does it mean if a car can reach 299 or 300 as a top speed? Or if it can go 330 kph instead?

    Important is the way up there and how else it performs.



    I agree. Makes for good bragging rights if it does 330 though, doesn't it?



    Hehehe, agreed.

    And you're king of top trumps.

    Re: 997 Turbo - Powerkit

    Quote:
    Rossi said:
    Quote:
    Crash said:
    Quote:
    Rossi said:
    Quote:
    Crash said:
    Quote:
    eclou said:
    Quote:
    Crash said:
    Also, you'd expect a real 320 km/h, not some number that barely equals the 430 and the Gallardo.



    top speed is pure fantasy. I bet 1 in 100 will ever attempt it



    I will. Did with every car I've ever driven. Then again, I'm sure you're right about the US, where you'd go straight to jail .



    Topspeed nowadays is a useless waste-product of the ever increasing power figures. What does it mean if a car can reach 299 or 300 as a top speed? Or if it can go 330 kph instead?

    Important is the way up there and how else it performs.



    I agree. Makes for good bragging rights if it does 330 though, doesn't it?



    Hehehe, agreed.

    And you're king of top trumps.



    True. Right until some guy comes in with an S600 and calls 12 cylinders versus your 6 .

    Re: 997 Turbo - Powerkit

    Quote:
    Crash said:
    Quote:
    Rossi said:
    Quote:
    Crash said:
    Quote:
    Rossi said:
    Quote:
    Crash said:
    Quote:
    eclou said:
    Quote:
    Crash said:
    Also, you'd expect a real 320 km/h, not some number that barely equals the 430 and the Gallardo.



    top speed is pure fantasy. I bet 1 in 100 will ever attempt it



    I will. Did with every car I've ever driven. Then again, I'm sure you're right about the US, where you'd go straight to jail .



    Topspeed nowadays is a useless waste-product of the ever increasing power figures. What does it mean if a car can reach 299 or 300 as a top speed? Or if it can go 330 kph instead?

    Important is the way up there and how else it performs.



    I agree. Makes for good bragging rights if it does 330 though, doesn't it?



    Hehehe, agreed.

    And you're king of top trumps.



    True. Right until some guy comes in with an S600 and calls 12 cylinders versus your 6 .



    That was a mean move, Crash.

    Re: 997 Turbo - Powerkit

    Quote:
    Rossi said:
    Quote:
    Crash said:
    Quote:
    Rossi said:
    Quote:
    Crash said:
    Quote:
    Rossi said:
    Quote:
    Crash said:
    Quote:
    eclou said:
    Quote:
    Crash said:
    Also, you'd expect a real 320 km/h, not some number that barely equals the 430 and the Gallardo.



    top speed is pure fantasy. I bet 1 in 100 will ever attempt it



    I will. Did with every car I've ever driven. Then again, I'm sure you're right about the US, where you'd go straight to jail .



    Topspeed nowadays is a useless waste-product of the ever increasing power figures. What does it mean if a car can reach 299 or 300 as a top speed? Or if it can go 330 kph instead?

    Important is the way up there and how else it performs.



    I agree. Makes for good bragging rights if it does 330 though, doesn't it?



    Hehehe, agreed.

    And you're king of top trumps.



    True. Right until some guy comes in with an S600 and calls 12 cylinders versus your 6 .



    That was a mean move, Crash.



    No, that was a brilliant move . A mean move would be taking a Renault Clio and a Ferrari 430 and then comparing the number of doors .

    Re: 997 Turbo - Powerkit

    Quote:
    Crash said:
    Quote:
    Rossi said:
    Quote:
    Crash said:
    Quote:
    Rossi said:
    Quote:
    Crash said:
    Quote:
    Rossi said:
    Quote:
    Crash said:
    Quote:
    eclou said:
    Quote:
    Crash said:
    Also, you'd expect a real 320 km/h, not some number that barely equals the 430 and the Gallardo.



    top speed is pure fantasy. I bet 1 in 100 will ever attempt it



    I will. Did with every car I've ever driven. Then again, I'm sure you're right about the US, where you'd go straight to jail .



    Topspeed nowadays is a useless waste-product of the ever increasing power figures. What does it mean if a car can reach 299 or 300 as a top speed? Or if it can go 330 kph instead?

    Important is the way up there and how else it performs.



    I agree. Makes for good bragging rights if it does 330 though, doesn't it?



    Hehehe, agreed.

    And you're king of top trumps.



    True. Right until some guy comes in with an S600 and calls 12 cylinders versus your 6 .



    That was a mean move, Crash.



    No, that was a brilliant move . A mean move would be taking a Renault Clio and a Ferrari 430 and then comparing the number of doors .



    Sorry, Clios are not allowed in the card game.

    Elder-statesmen...

    Quote:
    VKSF said:... Even elder-statesmen cars like 599 and 65 have elegantly intimidating exhaust notes ...



    "Elder-statesmen cars" ... that says it all. I take a base 911 over an " elder-statesman" car any day.

    Re: 997 Turbo - Powerkit

    Quote:
    Rossi said:
    Quote:
    Crash said:
    Quote:
    Rossi said:
    Quote:
    Crash said:
    Quote:
    Rossi said:
    Quote:
    Crash said:
    Quote:
    Rossi said:
    Quote:
    Crash said:
    Quote:
    eclou said:
    Quote:
    Crash said:
    Also, you'd expect a real 320 km/h, not some number that barely equals the 430 and the Gallardo.



    top speed is pure fantasy. I bet 1 in 100 will ever attempt it



    I will. Did with every car I've ever driven. Then again, I'm sure you're right about the US, where you'd go straight to jail .



    Topspeed nowadays is a useless waste-product of the ever increasing power figures. What does it mean if a car can reach 299 or 300 as a top speed? Or if it can go 330 kph instead?

    Important is the way up there and how else it performs.



    I agree. Makes for good bragging rights if it does 330 though, doesn't it?



    Hehehe, agreed.

    And you're king of top trumps.



    True. Right until some guy comes in with an S600 and calls 12 cylinders versus your 6 .



    That was a mean move, Crash.



    No, that was a brilliant move . A mean move would be taking a Renault Clio and a Ferrari 430 and then comparing the number of doors .



    Sorry, Clios are not allowed in the card game.



    Okay. This then:



     
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