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    Re: OFFICIAL: New 991.2 GT3

    SmileySmileySmiley


    --

    2014 Porsche 991 C4S Black with Sports Design Package,  2013 Porsche Cayenne Dark Blue Metallic, New York


    Re: OFFICIAL: New 991.2 GT3

    Have not been here for awhile and it's a good laugh, in a good way, to see that the same healthy discussion is going on here as elsewhere, or at least on Rennlist. ie  Stick vs. PDK. Whatever turns you on, this is going to be an amazing car in either guise.... a win/win. I have enjoyed reading the thread with all of the insights. What a car!  kiss


    Re: OFFICIAL: New 991.2 GT3

    The farmer:
    watt:

    Can anyone tell me when the RS is due?  Thanks

    Latest rumor I heard indicates GT2 RS in Frankfurt and GT3 (.2) RS Geneva 2018. But.... nothing confirmed Smiley 

    GT3(.2 )RS said to have 4,2 l and 530-550hp.....Smiley

    GT2 RS is a sure thing...GT3 RS isn't. Also if GT3 RS is coming, no more than 530 hp with that rumored 4.2 l engine. 550 hp are an illusion. Smiley


    --

    RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Carrera 4 GTS Cabriolet (2015), Porsche Cayenne S Diesel (2017), Audi R8 V10 Plus (2016), Mini JCW (2015)


    Re: OFFICIAL: New 991.2 GT3

    SciFrog:

    The GT3 non RS is what the GTS should be. That's why it is infuriating and insulting that they don't offer rear seats and convertible.

    I agree but why make the GTS more expensive if customers are happy with "less"... Smiley There is also that CO2 output thingie, fleet consumption, etc...


    --

    RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Carrera 4 GTS Cabriolet (2015), Porsche Cayenne S Diesel (2017), Audi R8 V10 Plus (2016), Mini JCW (2015)


    Re: OFFICIAL: New 991.2 GT3

    What about the 'basic' GT2, anyone?


    Re: OFFICIAL: New 991.2 GT3

    The upside of Platinum is that when they get brake dust on them, you can't tell...

    The downside of Platinum is that they look like they have brake dust on them when they are clean...

    LOL Grant...

    I had Black OZ's on my 7.2 thinking of going black/black again. There's no accounting for taste.

    IMG_0237 (4).JPG


    Re: OFFICIAL: New 991.2 GT3

    Looks pretty mean kiss


    --

    73 Carrera RS 2.7 Carbon Fiber replica (1,890 lbs), 06 EVO9 with track mods. Former: 16 Cayman GT4, 73 911S, Two 951S's, 996 C2, 993 C2, 98 Ferrari 550, 79 635CSi


    Re: OFFICIAL: New 991.2 GT3

    As some say: Black is not color - it is work.

    But I love it!

     


    Re: OFFICIAL: New 991.2 GT3

    Carlos from Spain:
    SciFrog:

    The GT3 non RS is what the GTS should be. That's why it is infuriating and insulting that they don't offer rear seats and convertible.

    If Porsche would make a GT3 Cabrio they would be the laughing stock and would loose all their hard earnt respect from sportscar enthusiasts around the world.

    The GT3 is not a carbon tub mid-engined two seater, a "911" GT3 made cabrio would be very heavy rendering all its weight saving features null and impact its handling and performance advantages, the decreased chasis stiffness of the cabrio 911 chasis would also compromise its handling to the point that 991 Cabrio versions cannot even have the stiffer GT3-like -20mm sport suspension optioned because of this decreases chasis stiffness, all GT3 aerodynamics would be completely shot and useless.... it would be like a GT3 optioned with 4x4 off road tires and shocks, makes no sense and would defeat the whole purpose of the GT3, and the fact that its all traded in for the ability to cruise opentop makes it even worse, would give it a poseur stigma since it will not drive anywhere near like a GT3 just carry the badge. None of the GT3 owners here would touch that "thing" with a 10 foot pole.

     

    ⇒ Carlos - Porsche 991 Carrera GTS

     

    That's your opinion. But IMHO it is flawed:
    there is no reason to think that a GT3 cabrio improvements vs a GTS cabrio would not be close to the difference between a coupe GT3 and a coupe GTS.

    You want to compare a GT3 cabrio vs a GT3 coupe performance and say the GT3 cabrio will not be as good as the GT3 coupe. Of course it won't, but you are completely missing the real relevant question: how will it compare to a GTS cabrio and a turbo S cabrio? How will it compare to 488, McLaren and Huracan open tops?

    You are a coupe guy, fine. But many here would always opt for the extra enjoyment of the open top for an acceptable loss of performance, a gap which has reduced with every new generation of cars. Porsche simply does not offer an acceptable driver oriented exclusive convertible sport car (918 aside).

    As far as a GT3 being a poseur car, sorry but to me the 991 normal GT3 owners are the poseurs. Why? Well the RS is a track oriented car, the normal GT3 is more of a daily driver confortable car that can handle occasional track, but tacked with a huge wing and aggressive design. Yet many will never even come close to a track. So who are the poseurs again?


    Re: OFFICIAL: New 991.2 GT3

    Nacelle1:

    The upside of Platinum is that when they get brake dust on them, you can't tell...

    The downside of Platinum is that they look like they have brake dust on them when they are clean...

    LOL Grant...

    I had Black OZ's on my 7.2 thinking of going black/black again. There's no accounting for taste.

    IMG_0237 (4).JPG

     

    Black on black on black looks really good Smiley

    Pic taken in BC I presume? BC plate? That's a long driveway Smiley

    Screen Shot 2017-03-27 at 8.04.55 AM.png


    --

     

     


    Re: OFFICIAL: New 991.2 GT3

    SciFrog:
    As far as a GT3 being a poseur car, sorry but to me the 991 normal GT3 owners are the poseurs. Why? Well the RS is a track oriented car, the normal GT3 is more of a daily driver confortable car that can handle occasional track, but tacked with a huge wing and aggressive design. Yet many will never even come close to a track. So who are the poseurs again?

    I believe the official numbers suggest that 80% of all GT cars have been driven on a track at some time.


    --

    73 Carrera RS 2.7 Carbon Fiber replica (1,890 lbs), 06 EVO9 with track mods. Former: 16 Cayman GT4, 73 911S, Two 951S's, 996 C2, 993 C2, 98 Ferrari 550, 79 635CSi


    Re: OFFICIAL: New 991.2 GT3

    SciFrog:

    That's your opinion. But IMHO it is flawed:
    there is no reason to think that a GT3 cabrio improvements vs a GTS cabrio would not be close to the difference between a coupe GT3 and a coupe GTS.

    You want to compare a GT3 cabrio vs a GT3 coupe performance and say the GT3 cabrio will not be as good as the GT3 coupe. Of course it won't, but you are completely missing the real relevant question: how will it compare to a GTS cabrio and a turbo S cabrio? How will it compare to 488, McLaren and Huracan open tops?

    The problem I think is that you are missing the point of the GT3 concept, its not just a badge to parade around, a GT3 made cabrio would not be a GT3 anymore because the compromises made for it to be cabrio would remove everything that makes the GT3 different from the rest of the 991 variants. You can make a GTS cabrio, that is fine, or a Turbo, but you cannot make a GT3 or GT2 cabrio. Its like making a 911 with a VW diesel engine to save fuel.

     

    You are a coupe guy, fine. But many here would always opt for the extra enjoyment of the open top for an acceptable loss of performance, a gap which has reduced with every new generation of cars. Porsche simply does not offer an acceptable driver oriented exclusive convertible sport car (918 aside).

    As far as a GT3 being a poseur car, sorry but to me the 991 normal GT3 owners are the poseurs. Why? Well the RS is a track oriented car, the normal GT3 is more of a daily driver confortable car that can handle occasional track, but tacked with a huge wing and aggressive design. Yet many will never even come close to a track. So who are the poseurs again?

    The GT3 is NOT a poseur car, don't know were you got that, the GT3 is my favorite 911 variant in the line up, nor did I say that a cabrio would be a poseur car either just in case, what I said was that a "GT3 cabrio" would be a complete poseur car for the reasons I mentioned above, useless as a GT3.

    Porsche would never come out with something like that as they would loose a lot of respect, and that is why you have never seen one or even anyone even mentioning such a car, either from Porsche or even the press ever contemplating such a possibility. You are alone in this for a reason.

    I get it you like cabrios and that is completely fine, I do not think less of them at all because they are cabrio, there are hyperperforming supercars that are cabrio, but they have a carbon tub and are designed from the ground up to be opentop.


    --

    ⇒ Carlos - Porsche 991 Carrera GTS

     


    Re: OFFICIAL: New 991.2 GT3

    Grant:
    SciFrog:
    As far as a GT3 being a poseur car, sorry but to me the 991 normal GT3 owners are the poseurs. Why? Well the RS is a track oriented car, the normal GT3 is more of a daily driver confortable car that can handle occasional track, but tacked with a huge wing and aggressive design. Yet many will never even come close to a track. So who are the poseurs again?

    I believe the official numbers suggest that 80% of all GT cars have been driven on a track at some time.

    What goes on in Miami on only a very small part of what GT3 owners do in other parts of the world .

    Where I live , I hardly ever see a GT3 on the road . But when I go to the track, I see loads of GT3 with number plates from my region . 


    --

     964 Carrera 4 --  997.2 C2S , -20mm --  991 GT3 RS 


    Re: OFFICIAL: New 991.2 GT3

    I totally can see that in Europe, since owning a sport car is already regarded as a bad non eco thing for people with big egos, GT3 would be tracked a lot, since it is "so" outrageous that only hardcore drivers would own them.

    But in the USA it seems to be different. And not only in Miami where I sadly spend less than a month a year angry (for now). Keywords? Speculation and flippers...


    Re: OFFICIAL: New 991.2 GT3

    Lots of GT3's at the track here in Colorado...


    --

    73 Carrera RS 2.7 Carbon Fiber replica (1,890 lbs), 06 EVO9 with track mods. Former: 16 Cayman GT4, 73 911S, Two 951S's, 996 C2, 993 C2, 98 Ferrari 550, 79 635CSi


    Re: OFFICIAL: New 991.2 GT3

     It will be interesting to see if a Speedster will come out. Will it be more GT3 or more GTS?

    I'd bet that it will have a lot more of GT3 elements, to make it special. 

    SciFrog, if you can get one, it may be the car you are looking for!

    I'm first on line for a future Speedster, but I realize it doesn't mean s...t. 

    I think it will be like another R... not for mere mortals 


    --

    2016 Carrera 4 GTS Jet Black,

    2016 Macan Turbo Agata Grey,

    2012 Infiniti G370 Grey,

    2014 Mercedes E350 Steel Gray


    Re: OFFICIAL: New 991.2 GT3

    pcosta:

     It will be interesting to see if a Speedster will come out. Will it be more GT3 or more GTS?

    I'd bet that it will have a lot more of GT3 elements, to make it special. 

    SciFrog, if you can get one, it may be the car you are looking for!

    I'm first on line for a future Speedster, but I realize it doesn't mean s...t. 

    I think it will be like another R... not for mere mortals 

    SciFrog is not interested.  Speedsters do not have back seats...

     

    1490646400424997_speedster.jpg


    --

     

     

    73 Carrera RS 2.7 Carbon Fiber replica (1,890 lbs), 06 EVO9 with track mods. Former: 16 Cayman GT4, 73 911S, Two 951S's, 996 C2, 993 C2, 98 Ferrari 550, 79 635CSi

     


    Re: OFFICIAL: New 991.2 GT3

    No worries, I already own the sport cars I was looking for, they just aren't made by Porsche... Just babbling about Porsche lost opportunity to create a special car, but the bean counters have prevalence...


    Re: OFFICIAL: New 991.2 GT3

    Whoopsy:
    Nacelle1:

    The upside of Platinum is that when they get brake dust on them, you can't tell...

    The downside of Platinum is that they look like they have brake dust on them when they are clean...

    LOL Grant...

    I had Black OZ's on my 7.2 thinking of going black/black again. There's no accounting for taste.

    IMG_0237 (4).JPG

     

    Black on black on black looks really good Smiley

    Pic taken in BC I presume? BC plate? That's a long driveway Smiley

    Screen Shot 2017-03-27 at 8.04.55 AM.png

    LOL... Pic was taken in my driveway in ON, since then have moved to the Island and split between time in CO. Sold car last summer to someone in Vancouver. You might see it around there but guy got in a nasty fender bender just after he picked it up but I hear it is on the road  again. Very short  driveway on the Island now... 

    edit: kept the wheels and have them on my Platinum  Silver 7.2 Turbo  S

     


    --

     

    997.2 Porsche Turbo S      '16   MB  AMG E6ES Estate       '17 VW Golf R

     


    Re: OFFICIAL: New 991.2 GT3

    Haha, Ontario, that's explains the long driveway :)


    --

     

     


    Re: OFFICIAL: New 991.2 GT3

    Carlos from Spain:
    SciFrog:

    The GT3 non RS is what the GTS should be. That's why it is infuriating and insulting that they don't offer rear seats and convertible.

    If Porsche would make a GT3 Cabrio they would be the laughing stock and would loose all their hard earnt respect from sportscar enthusiasts around the world.

    The GT3 is not a carbon tub mid-engined two seater, a "911" GT3 made cabrio would be very heavy rendering all its weight saving features null and impact its handling and performance advantages, the decreased chasis stiffness of the cabrio 911 chasis would also compromise its handling to the point that 991 Cabrio versions cannot even have the stiffer GT3-like -20mm sport suspension optioned because of this decreases chasis stiffness, all GT3 aerodynamics would be completely shot and useless.... it would be like a GT3 optioned with 4x4 off road tires and shocks, makes no sense and would defeat the whole purpose of the GT3, and the fact that its all traded in for the ability to cruise opentop makes it even worse, would give it a poseur stigma since it will not drive anywhere near like a GT3 just carry the badge. None of the GT3 owners here would touch that "thing" with a 10 foot pole.

    Now, if we are talking about a 960 designed from the ground up as an opentop with a hard roof and a carbon tub like the 918, then that is completely different. Or dropping the GT3 engine on a GTS, no problem with that, but it would be a GTS in all the rest, and have a GTS badge not a GT3 badge, cause it would have nothing to do with a GT3.


    --

     

    ⇒ Carlos - Porsche 991 Carrera GTS

     

    Besides your 100% valid (and obvious, I don't know why anyone would think about a GT3 cab) points, the other issue is that the GT3 is not a stylish car.  It is not its purpose, while even for e.g. a 458 Speciale is stylish so it makes sense to provide an open top variant.  And any cab has to look attractive, it is part of the appeal.  So it would not work as a cab for aesthetics reason either.


    Re: OFFICIAL: New 991.2 GT3

    It seems that the "GT3" badge is more of expressing Porsche's racing heritage on road cars. GT3 RS is no doubt a supreme track machine and that's why (I think) there is still space in the market for a road use performance/track car from Porsche. It would be sad (just a personal feel) to see Porsche to go down the route like BMW (M cars for almost all models) or Mercedes (AMG cars for almost all models) to have something like a GT3 911 cab, GT3 boxster, GT3 panamera or GT3 Cayenne/Macan. Even for the Cayman, they did not use the GT3 moniker but GT4 for the track version to distinguish them. I think the GT3 badge is too special for Porsche and its track-oriented customers. The current strategy of Porsche seems to work extremely well by keeping the GTS for a very sporty feeling of their non-track related models while the GT cars are confined to their track related model lines. By the way, I think the new 991.2 GT3's design is very stylish and is the most beautiful 911 to date (IT IS JUST AWESOME!). That's my 2 cents!
     


    Re: OFFICIAL: New 991.2 GT3

    PDK made the GT3 accessible to a much wider crowd that I would consider it now the "sporty" model - it can surely be a DD


    Re: OFFICIAL: New 991.2 GT3

    I think the typical GT3 customer base is a more hardcore Porsche customer base which has certain ideas and assumptions about the GT3. A GT3 without rear wing or a GT3 Cab could seriously harm this customer base and thus Porsche's "GT" cars business. 

    Which brings me back to those 3% I always get to hear when I complaint about the lack of certain models. yes


    --

    RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Carrera 4 GTS Cabriolet (2015), Porsche Cayenne S Diesel (2017), Audi R8 V10 Plus (2016), Mini JCW (2015)


    Re: OFFICIAL: New 991.2 GT3

    I'll take a step further and say if you want the fastest road car track car, you don't want pdk, you want a Ferrari or a McLaren or Lamborghini or Corvette or even a 911 Turbo S ;)


    Re: OFFICIAL: New 991.2 GT3

    noone1:

    I'll take a step further and say if you want the fastest road car track car, you don't want pdk, you want a Ferrari or a McLaren or Lamborghini or Corvette or even a 911 Turbo S ;)

    If you want to drive MANY laps, the GT3 still has many advantages over those models.  Both in the way that it drives and the resilience it shows.  For instance, the Corvette Z06 has heat-soaking issues that require limp mode rather quickly which the NA GT3 never suffers - just as fast on lap 30 as lap 3.


    --

    73 Carrera RS 2.7 Carbon Fiber replica (1,890 lbs), 06 EVO9 with track mods. Former: 16 Cayman GT4, 73 911S, Two 951S's, 996 C2, 993 C2, 98 Ferrari 550, 79 635CSi


    Re: OFFICIAL: New 991.2 GT3

    Or a GT4 indecision


    --

    2015 981 Cayman GT4 | Powerkit White - The fastest car on Rennteam
    2013 Audi S3 | Glacier White


    Re: OFFICIAL: New 991.2 GT3

    Absolutely- even more reliable than GT3 kiss


    --

    73 Carrera RS 2.7 Carbon Fiber replica (1,890 lbs), 06 EVO9 with track mods. Former: 16 Cayman GT4, 73 911S, Two 951S's, 996 C2, 993 C2, 98 Ferrari 550, 79 635CSi


    Re: OFFICIAL: New 991.2 GT3

    Grant:
    noone1:

    I'll take a step further and say if you want the fastest road car track car, you don't want pdk, you want a Ferrari or a McLaren or Lamborghini or Corvette or even a 911 Turbo S ;)

    If you want to drive MANY laps, the GT3 still has many advantages over those models.  Both in the way that it drives and the resilience it shows.  For instance, the Corvette Z06 has heat-soaking issues that require limp mode rather quickly which the NA GT3 never suffers - just as fast on lap 30 as lap 3.

    US cars and heat soaking issues...my GT500 had the same problem until I installed a much larger heat exchanger with two gigantic fans (for those red light...ehhmm...drag races in summer Smiley) and adapted the ECU to 100 octane instead of 98 octane but used 102 octane fuel instead. Even at 40°C and hot summer air...a beast. Smiley

    The V10 of the R8 also runs better with 102 octane fuel in summer, it keeps thermodynamics in the green. No performance increase but also no heat soaking. Smiley

    Those little tricks... Smiley

    Btw: Even Porsche cars have heat soaking issues but the ECU is very well adapted and you barely feel it. A very gradual transition in power, rather than entering some sort of limp mode. Smiley


    --

     

    RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Carrera 4 GTS Cabriolet (2015), Porsche Cayenne S Diesel (2017), Audi R8 V10 Plus (2016), Mini JCW (2015)

     


    Re: OFFICIAL: New 991.2 GT3

    Grant:
    noone1:

    I'll take a step further and say if you want the fastest road car track car, you don't want pdk, you want a Ferrari or a McLaren or Lamborghini or Corvette or even a 911 Turbo S ;)

    If you want to drive MANY laps, the GT3 still has many advantages over those models.  Both in the way that it drives and the resilience it shows.  For instance, the Corvette Z06 has heat-soaking issues that require limp mode rather quickly which the NA GT3 never suffers - just as fast on lap 30 as lap 3.

    A few years ago Sun and his friend Roland got stupid and bought z06s....,

    three laps of little Willow Springs and Roland's transmission was frozen solid.

    Z06=absolute POS🤑🤑🤑🤑


     
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