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    Re: OFFICIAL: New Panamera (2016)

    ALDO:
    SciFrog:

    I doubt you will switch if the Panamera is a still as boring to drive as the last version...

    You don´t get tired telling us that the Panamera (turbo) is boring to drive. Maybe you can explain us what makes this car so boring to drive. What are other sedans making better that they are more enjoyable to drive.

     

    Other sedans? No idea to be honest since I have no interest in them. But others have expressed the Audi and Mercedes are close. I however drove it back to back with a Cayenne TTS and a 612 and found the Panamera acceleration smoother and less explosive, the car didn't feel it was pulling harder. Both Porsche engines being turbo were pretty linear and boring. Handling on the Panamera felt very disconnect from the road and you could feel all the nannies to make the car fast. The Cayenne TTS felt more direct and "butch" defying the SUV moniker, of course the Panamera handles better, but not enough difference to justify the price gap.  Compared to the 612 which drives amazingly light the Panamera could not make its weight forgotten.

    Then came the Macan turbo, as Autocar says this week, it is in its own league of SUV/crossovers in handling and feels like a Panamera yet costs a fraction and is more practical.


    Re: OFFICIAL: New Panamera (2016)

    My guess is the new Panamera design will--in addition to the expected '' humpback RIP" press reviews--receive number of awards.  Well deserved, in my view.  The car's success will depend on the world economy, not on competition from others, or from weight.  it is a unique and desirable and damn fast car--finely engineered and constructed--and will continue to evolve.  

    On the price of Porsches in general, while Porsche is certainly pushing my financial boundary with college age kids, big city living, estate planning, etc., I have to admit there are thousands of more prosperous folks who can easily afford fine cars in the mid to upper 100K range.  For these folks, scribbling a $150K check is barely noticeable. In the metropolitan area where I live, upper middle class average net worth approaches $3 million.  I can only imagine the number of Porsche buyers whose net worth is in the tens or hundreds of millions.  When you throw in lease programs, a monthly payment of 3K or so for a 150K car is barely more than several expensive dinners at top class restaurants.

    And I would add that, in my view, a very finely appointed Panamera or 991, is absolutely worth its price.  I currently have a well optioned 2105 Cayenne Turbo as my daily driver, and it is worth every penny in quality, performance, and superb driving experience.  And when my lease is up, will i stretch and stretch and drive my wife nuts  for another high range Porsche?  I will let you guess...


    Re: OFFICIAL: New Panamera (2016)

    Whoopsy:

    I have the FF already, and if the next Panamera Turbo S do indeed have performance hybrid power, I will switch in a heart beat, even giving up the wonderful V12 sound.

     

    Can you please elaborate? Thanks.


    Re: OFFICIAL: New Panamera (2016)

    Wonderbar:

    My guess is the new Panamera design will--in addition to the expected '' humpback RIP" press reviews--receive number of awards.  Well deserved, in my view.  The car's success will depend on the world economy, not on competition from others, or from weight.  it is a unique and desirable and damn fast car--finely engineered and constructed--and will continue to evolve.  

    On the price of Porsches in general, while Porsche is certainly pushing my financial boundary with college age kids, big city living, estate planning, etc., I have to admit there are thousands of more prosperous folks who can easily afford fine cars in the mid to upper 100K range.  For these folks, scribbling a $150K check is barely noticeable. In the metropolitan area where I live, upper middle class average net worth approaches $3 million.  I can only imagine the number of Porsche buyers whose net worth is in the tens or hundreds of millions.  When you throw in lease programs, a monthly payment of 3K or so for a 150K car is barely more than several expensive dinners at top class restaurants.

    And I would add that, in my view, a very finely appointed Panamera or 991, is absolutely worth its price.  I currently have a well optioned 2105 Cayenne Turbo as my daily driver, and it is worth every penny in quality, performance, and superb driving experience.  And when my lease is up, will i stretch and stretch and drive my wife nuts  for another high range Porsche?  I will let you guess...

    I quite agree with most that you said.Smiley

    Yes, the Panamera price is high, but it has always been.  I don't see people complaining that Ferrari and Lambo are expensive.

    BTW, I do not think Porsche is meant for everyone to buy.  There are always cheaper sedan options.

    Try going in a top class restaurant and complain that their steaks are too costly, and they don't taste that good either.  What answer do you expect the chef to give you?  I think most already know the answer.


    --

    Tim

    2010 997.2 GT3RS;  2008 Cayenne Turbo;  2006 911 Club Coupe;  2016 911 GTS Club Coupe;  2015 Macan S
     


    Re: OFFICIAL: New Panamera (2016)

    Paulo_Rangel_Melo:

    Hey RC. We can assume that the new 911 due in about 2/2 and half years will pack pretty much the same interior as the new Panamera right?

     

    Regards.

    The speedo cluster will look similar but that whole middle console with the touch buttons will be different as far as I heard. Porsche wants to differentiate the 911 more from the Panamera/Cayenne/Macan. Also, the 911 top models (GT models and Turbo) could get a different speedo cluster design to differentiate these models even further from the 911. Nothing radical though but there will be a difference.

    The next gen 911 will be taken to a different (higher) quality level, this is for sure. Smiley


    --

    RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Carrera 4 GTS Cabriolet, Porsche Macan Turbo, Audi R8 V10 Plus (2017), Mini JCW (2015), Jeep Grand Cherokee SRT (2014)


    Re: OFFICIAL: New Panamera (2016)

    Wonderbar:
    For these folks, scribbling a $150K check is barely noticeable. In the metropolitan area where I live, upper middle class average net worth approaches $3 million.  I can only imagine the number of Porsche buyers whose net worth is in the tens or hundreds of millions.  When you throw in lease programs, a monthly payment of 3K or so for a 150K car is barely more than several expensive dinners at top class restaurants.

    Porsche will be glad to hear that. Smiley But I think they already know itSmiley

    And yes I share your point of view. It's so much money around the world and Porsche just will sell cars to people with adequate income. 


    --

    Kind regards, Conny 



    Porsche 997.2 Turbo S  *  BMW Grand Coupe 650i xDrive


     

    Re: OFFICIAL: New Panamera (2016)

    Ziggy:
    Whoopsy:

    I have the FF already, and if the next Panamera Turbo S do indeed have performance hybrid power, I will switch in a heart beat, even giving up the wonderful V12 sound.

     

    Can you please elaborate? Thanks.

     

    The answer for that question is listed in the lines you deleted from the quote :)


    --

     

     


    Re: OFFICIAL: New Panamera (2016)

    Targa Tim:
     

    Try going in a top class restaurant and complain that their steaks are too costly, and they don't taste that good either.  What answer do you expect the chef to give you?  I think most already know the answer.

    We complain about bad food at top restaurants quite often since we have the experience to make positive critism to help them (and our opinion always seems to be welcome as a proper feedback) and we are often comped courses, offered drinks or more. Our critics are always justified and presented with a positive attitude, and we never ask for something extra because of it but wait for them to offer. That said since we eat at over 100 Michelin star restaurants a year, we really know our stuff Smiley


    Re: OFFICIAL: New Panamera (2016)

    Whoopsy:

    It will be especially more so for the next gen S8 which will ride on the same platform.

    It won't be on the same platform. The Panamera is based on the MSB developed by Porsche for the Panamera and Bentley. The future A8 will use another platform that will support FWD configuration.


    Re: OFFICIAL: New Panamera (2016)

    Two questions: [1] does anyone know if the new Panamera also ushers in a new key design or does it use the old car-shaped fob? [2] is there a downloadable brochure out there yet?

    Cheers guys.

    rulesdontapply


    --

    2008 Porsche Boxster S PDE2
    2012 Porsche Cayenne S [gone but never forgotten]


    Re: OFFICIAL: New Panamera (2016)

    Herbaliser:
    Whoopsy:

    It will be especially more so for the next gen S8 which will ride on the same platform.

    It won't be on the same platform. The Panamera is based on the MSB developed by Porsche for the Panamera and Bentley. The future A8 will use another platform that will support FWD configuration.

    The new Audi A8 will very likely be based on the new MLB/PL65 platform, similar to the new Q7. Biggest advantage over the MSB platform Porsche uses for the Panamera and next Bentley Continental: Weight. The MLB/PL65 platform permits a lighter A8. Also, the new A8 will get the W12 Biturbo engine from the Bentayga, rumored power will be over 600 hp.


    --

    RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Carrera 4 GTS Cabriolet, Porsche Macan Turbo, Audi R8 V10 Plus (2017), Mini JCW (2015), Jeep Grand Cherokee SRT (2014)


    Re: OFFICIAL: New Panamera (2016)

    Herbaliser:
    Whoopsy:

    It will be especially more so for the next gen S8 which will ride on the same platform.

    It won't be on the same platform. The Panamera is based on the MSB developed by Porsche for the Panamera and Bentley. The future A8 will use another platform that will support FWD configuration.

     

    I stand corrected then.

    I knew Audi wasn't included in the initial MSB platform draft, they had insisted on doing their own things, but that was with Piech watching over them. I had under the impression that when Piech was gone so was Audi's leverage and they were told to toe the company line once again. 

     


    --

     

     


    Re: OFFICIAL: New Panamera (2016)

    Spec of Turbo to my liking is $184k. Ouch. I won't be getting one. 


    --

    2013 BMW 750 xDrive & 2014 x5 & 2014 991 TTS Cab 2014 BMW i3 2017 Porsche Mission E & 991.2 GT3 on order


    Re: OFFICIAL: New Panamera (2016)

    My very well optioned Macan turbo was $97k list, I paid $93k... Only thing missing is the Burmeister... Granted it is a tad underpowered... Somehow it seems the last dealer visit fixed my only real critic of the car: the bobbing up and down of the front in acceleration/braking.

    The Panamera turbo S will break $200k. That is just crazy. After 3 years you won't even get $80k in trade in value.


    Re: OFFICIAL: New Panamera (2016)

    Whoopsy:
    Ziggy:
    Whoopsy:

    I have the FF already, and if the next Panamera Turbo S do indeed have performance hybrid power, I will switch in a heart beat, even giving up the wonderful V12 sound.

     

    Can you please elaborate? Thanks.

     

    The answer for that question is listed in the lines you deleted from the quote :)

    I see. I was curious if you had any grudge against the FF that made you considering switching if an appropriate competitor arises.


    Re: OFFICIAL: New Panamera (2016)

    Ziggy:
    Whoopsy:
    Ziggy:
    Whoopsy:

    I have the FF already, and if the next Panamera Turbo S do indeed have performance hybrid power, I will switch in a heart beat, even giving up the wonderful V12 sound.

     

    Can you please elaborate? Thanks.

     

    The answer for that question is listed in the lines you deleted from the quote :)

    I see. I was curious if you had any grudge against the FF that made you considering switching if an appropriate competitor arises.

     

    Ah that.

    It's more like parking space related. No fault of the car. 

     


    --

     

     


    Re: OFFICIAL: New Panamera (2016)

    Whoopsy:
    Ziggy:
    Whoopsy:
    Ziggy:
    Whoopsy:

    I have the FF already, and if the next Panamera Turbo S do indeed have performance hybrid power, I will switch in a heart beat, even giving up the wonderful V12 sound.

     

    Can you please elaborate? Thanks.

     

    The answer for that question is listed in the lines you deleted from the quote :)

    I see. I was curious if you had any grudge against the FF that made you considering switching if an appropriate competitor arises.

     

    Ah that.

    It's more like parking space related. No fault of the car. 

     

    OK Nick, you can leave your FF and key at one of my parking space.  I know... what are friends for.Smiley


    --

    Tim

    2010 997.2 GT3RS;  2008 Cayenne Turbo;  2006 911 Club Coupe;  2016 911 GTS Club Coupe;  2015 Macan S
     


    Re: OFFICIAL: New Panamera (2016)

    wink


    --

    My new blog with automotive & motorcycle renders: tessoart.blogspot.com


    Re: OFFICIAL: New Panamera (2016)

    Sorry if repost

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HrcAicSzj3U


    --


    Re: OFFICIAL: New Panamera (2016)

    This is seriously funny - as the Driver was "our Driver" in the 918 in weissach - Boy the guy can drive ! Did not knew he was a NBR expert as well kisscool


    Re: OFFICIAL: New Panamera (2016)

    BjoernB:

    This is seriously funny - as the Driver was "our Driver" in the 918 in weissach - Boy the guy can drive ! Did not knew he was a NBR expert as well kisscool

    Lars Kern...I know him well...excellent driver...had the honor to test-drive the Turbo S with him on the Weissach track (he tried to scare the sh.t out of me but I tricked him...kept my hands in my lap but pressed my legs against the car for stability...I fooled him Smiley). He looked at me as if I'm an alien. Smiley I hope he doesn't read this now... Smiley Smiley


    --

     

    RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Carrera 4 GTS Cabriolet, Porsche Macan Turbo, Audi R8 V10 Plus (2017), Mini JCW (2015), Jeep Grand Cherokee SRT (2014)

     


    Re: OFFICIAL: New Panamera (2016)

    I hope he does - it was one of my automotive Highlights to sit next to guy who can drive 10/10th out of a 918.....


    Re: OFFICIAL: New Panamera (2016)

    BjoernB:

    I hope he does - it was one of my automotive Highlights to sit next to guy who can drive 10/10th out of a 918.....

    He is one of the nicest Porsche test drivers I ever met. Down to earth guy and a complete car nut. Smiley


    --

    RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Carrera 4 GTS Cabriolet, Porsche Macan Turbo, Audi R8 V10 Plus (2017), Mini JCW (2015), Jeep Grand Cherokee SRT (2014)


    Re: OFFICIAL: New Panamera (2016)

    SciFrog:

    My very well optioned Macan turbo was $97k list, I paid $93k... Only thing missing is the Burmeister... Granted it is a tad underpowered... Somehow it seems the last dealer visit fixed my only real critic of the car: the bobbing up and down of the front in acceleration/braking.

    The Panamera turbo S will break $200k. That is just crazy. After 3 years you won't even get $80k in trade in value.

    Yes. There are plenty of people with money to buy the new one. Those same people will not buy used. For resale you drop into another class of buyer for whom price is far more important, like me.  This naturally impacts used car prices especially for a sedan.  Look for the old sedan to drop like a rock now. 


    Re: OFFICIAL: New Panamera (2016)

    I agree that depreciation is rough, and that the old models will drop in price--especially because the new model is a beauty.  Good time to buy an old one at a 15-30% discount off MSRP.  

    But a new Panamera Turbo S dropping from 200K to 80K after 3 years?  Not sure of this number.  I had a 2009 Cayenne Turbo S which cost 129K new and I got 78K after 5 years on the trade for my new one...


    Re: OFFICIAL: New Panamera (2016)

    Lucky you, my friend and I had also 2009 Cayenne TTS, MSRP over $140k, he got $50k after 4 years, me at 5 years...


    Re: OFFICIAL: New Panamera (2016)


    Re: OFFICIAL: New Panamera (2016)

    This color doesn't suite Panamera well IMO enlightened


    --


    Re: OFFICIAL: New Panamera (2016)

    SportCarGroup:

    This color doesn't suite Panamera well IMO enlightened

    Big cars don't look good in shiny colors...


    --

    RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991 Carrera 4 GTS Cabriolet, Porsche Macan Turbo, Audi R8 V10 Plus (2017), Mini JCW (2015), Jeep Grand Cherokee SRT (2014)


    Re: OFFICIAL: New Panamera (2016)

    I love this blue sapphire and the new interior

     

     

     

     

     

     

     


     
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