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    Your Porsche 991-Point of view???

    I´m thinking about buying a manual 991 as a keeper for some years.

    The new 991.2 T is growing on me, but I fear that I don´t like the base brakes. But there is a chance to get one in a PTS-color.

    Also on my list are 991.1 GTS and 992.2 GTS as used cars - the prices for all 3 possibilities are not far away from each other.

    Waiting another 2 years for a used 991.2 GT3 Touring is also an option, but I want a 911 for this summer...

    What would you do?

    Blueflame

    PS I hate fixed wings and PDK, so no 991.1 GT3


    Re: Your Porsche 991-Point of view???

    991.1 GTS manual. The .2 GTS is the better car overall , performance and handling wise.  However if you prefer naturally aspirated engines there is not much choice.  I would exclude the T.  It is not special enough in the base configuration . Once you add the better brakes and the color to sample and eventually the buckets you enter into GTS territory and those are (imho) better cars . Pete Stout (000 Magazine) who test drove the T and he himself owns a base 991.2 Carrera with manual gearbox , indicated there were no significant differences between the two cars.  


    Re: Your Porsche 991-Point of view???

    blueflame:

    I´m thinking about buying a manual 991 as a keeper for some years.

    The new 991.2 T is growing on me, but I fear that I don´t like the base brakes. But there is a chance to get one in a PTS-color.

    Also on my list are 991.1 GTS and 992.2 GTS as used cars - the prices for all 3 possibilities are not far away from each other.

    Waiting another 2 years for a used 991.2 GT3 Touring is also an option, but I want a 911 for this summer...

    What would you do?

    Blueflame

    PS I hate fixed wings and PDK, so no 991.1 GT3

    From a value point of view, the 991.1 GTS is probably the best choice, last most powerful n/a engined 911 Carrera.

    From a performance point of view, the 991.2 GTS is the best choice, I have now for the 991.2 GTS Cab for a couple of weeks and I am surprised that I...love it. Sound is really OK for a turbo charged car and performance feels like a small 911 Turbo (which it basically is). Very refined car.

    991.2 T? I get the appeal of this car but nobody can really say if this car is going to keep it's value and the GTS is much faster on the Autobahn, like it or not.

    I would probably choose the 991.2 GTS right now (I may be biased though, now that I drive a 991.2 GTS).


    --

    RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991.2 Carrera GTS Cabriolet (2018), Porsche Cayenne S Diesel (2017), Audi R8 V10 Plus (2016), Mini JCW (2015)


    Re: Your Porsche 991-Point of view???

    Blueflame - I purchase a pre-owned 991.1 GTS (Porsche Warranty through 2022)  with manual transmission and less than 5000 miles on it last fall. It's the best 911 I have owned. I haven't driven a 991.2 GTS, so cannot offer any insights on .1 vs .2 GTS performance. RC is the best source since he has owned both. A 991 GTS will provide you immense driving enjoyed while you wait for that pre-owned GT3 touring edition.   


    --

    2016 Porsche 991 Carrera GTS  Black with AeroKit Cup Package,  2017 Porsche Cayenne Platinum  Purpurite Metallic, New York


    Re: Your Porsche 991-Point of view???

    bobr:

    Blueflame - I purchase a pre-owned 991.1 GTS (Porsche Warranty through 2022)  with manual transmission and less than 5000 miles on it last fall. It's the best 911 I have owned. I haven't driven a 991.2 GTS, so cannot offer any insights on .1 vs .2 GTS performance. RC is the best source since he has owned both. A 991 GTS will provide you immense driving enjoyed while you wait for that pre-owned GT3 touring edition.   

    The 991.1 GTS is an amazing car, n/a engine, wonderful.

    The 991.2 GTS feels more refined, it a typical turbo though but it sounds quite good and feels more modern.

    I like both a lot but would probably choose the 991.2 GTS over the 991.1 GTS now because I also have the Audi R8 (n/a) and I enjoy the "small 911 Turbo" feel of the 991.2 GTS. It is great to have both worlds (n/a and turbo), so you appreciate each of them.

    Btw: Look what fuel consumption the car has when my wife drives it, unbelievable for a 450 hp sportscar. Smiley

    IMG_0810.PNG


    --

    RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991.2 Carrera GTS Cabriolet (2018), Porsche Cayenne S Diesel (2017), Audi R8 V10 Plus (2016), Mini JCW (2015)


    Re: Your Porsche 991-Point of view???

    I will be a counter-point and say that I really like the T.  I like the interior and I like the ability to order LWB seats.  The base motor is still pretty powerful, has less lag, and can be cheaply tuned for more if needed.

    Here is a vid about tuned 991.2: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rg8xFlURy_4

    As for the brakes, what do you not like about them?  They will be plenty good for the street (they are the 991.1 Carrera S brakes).  Is it the color or the fact that you want better brakes for the track (many after-market and OEM alternatives, if you want).


    --

     

     

    18 GT3 Manual, 73 Carrera RS 2.7 Carbon Fiber replica (1,890 lbs), 06 EVO9 with track mods. Former: 16 Cayman GT4, 73 911S, Two 951S's, 996 C2, 993 C2, 98 Ferrari 550, 79 635CSi

     


    Re: Your Porsche 991-Point of view???

    Thanks for all your input. wink

    Right now I have a 981 Spyder, with the same brakes and almost the same HP of the 991.2 T.

    In the mountains this car is unbeatable and there are no problems with the brakes. But at Hockenheim GP-Course last year I was not convinced of the brakes after one day of hard driving.

    The 991.2 GT3 Touring would be perfect, but it‘s out of my budget - I pay for my fun cars in cash and don‘t like leasing or credits.

    I will let you know my choice...

    Thanks again

    Blueflame


    Re: Your Porsche 991-Point of view???

    blueflame:

    In the mountains this car is unbeatable and there are no problems with the brakes. But at Hockenheim GP-Course last year I was not convinced of the brakes after one day of hard driving.

    Even with my GT3 brakes this weekend, they didn't feel 100% up to the job.  I think a simple change of track brake pads and fluid is all that is needed for either car.  Since I had the same brakes on the GT4, I know what a big difference this can make.  My favorite pads are Race Technologies RE10 and favorite fluid is Endless RF-650 (Porsche uses this in Cup and RSR).


    --

     

     

    18 GT3 Manual, 73 Carrera RS 2.7 Carbon Fiber replica (1,890 lbs), 06 EVO9 with track mods. Former: 16 Cayman GT4, 73 911S, Two 951S's, 996 C2, 993 C2, 98 Ferrari 550, 79 635CSi

     


    Re: Your Porsche 991-Point of view???

    Grant:

    I will be a counter-point and say that I really like the T.  I like the interior and I like the ability to order LWB seats.  The base motor is still pretty powerful, has less lag, and can be cheaply tuned for more if needed.

    Here is a vid about tuned 991.2: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rg8xFlURy_4

    As for the brakes, what do you not like about them?  They will be plenty good for the street (they are the 991.1 Carrera S brakes).  Is it the color or the fact that you want better brakes for the track (many after-market and OEM alternatives, if you want).


    --

     

     

    18 GT3 Manual, 73 Carrera RS 2.7 Carbon Fiber replica (1,890 lbs), 06 EVO9 with track mods. Former: 16 Cayman GT4, 73 911S, Two 951S's, 996 C2, 993 C2, 98 Ferrari 550, 79 635CSi

     

     

    In Germany, tuning a Porsche is a big deal (warranty, resale value, etc.), so not worth it.


    --

    RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991.2 Carrera GTS Cabriolet (2018), Porsche Cayenne S Diesel (2017), Audi R8 V10 Plus (2016), Mini JCW (2015)


    Re: Your Porsche 991-Point of view???

    991.1 GTS then GT3 Touring at some stage in the future as the long term keeper

    Enjoy the hunt!


    Re: Your Porsche 991-Point of view???

    DJM48:

    991.1 GTS then GT3 Touring at some stage in the future as the long term keeper

    Enjoy the hunt!

    People who can't get a 991.2 GT3 Touring right now from the start will have a hard (and expensive) time to get one in the future, even used. I'd say that after the 991.1 R, the 991.2 GT3 Touring will be one of the most popular "collector" cars. The number may not be artificially limited but production has to end pretty soon eventually because of EU emissions requirements.


    --

    RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991.2 Carrera GTS Cabriolet (2018), Porsche Cayenne S Diesel (2017), Audi R8 V10 Plus (2016), Mini JCW (2015)


    Re: Your Porsche 991-Point of view???

    I don‘t think so.

    Right now, you can buy a manual or PDK 991.2 GT3 around list price in Germany. The prices will drop further...

    Not sure about the Touring, but Porsche produces too much of these cars and sells them not to drivers - most of them are bought by private „investors“...look at the 991.1 RS prices - they are getting cheaper and cheaper...and the first 991 R is under 300K €.

    I see the 991.2 GT3 prices in 2 years around 120K €.

    Blueflame


    Re: Your Porsche 991-Point of view???

    blueflame:

    I don‘t think so.

    Right now, you can buy a manual or PDK 991.2 GT3 around list price in Germany. The prices will drop further...

    I was talking about the Touring...

    Not sure about the Touring, but Porsche produces too much of these cars and sells them not to drivers - most of them are bought by private „investors“...look at the 991.1 RS prices - they are getting cheaper and cheaper...and the first 991 R is under 300K €.

    Touring will keep it's value...

    I see the 991.2 GT3 prices in 2 years around 120K €.

    Blueflame

    Depends...on the next generation. It is difficult to predict the values since we all know that we have a huge car market "bubble" right now because many people don't know what to do with their money, they don't trust the stock markets and buy cars instead. Smiley


    --

    RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991.2 Carrera GTS Cabriolet (2018), Porsche Cayenne S Diesel (2017), Audi R8 V10 Plus (2016), Mini JCW (2015)


    Re: Your Porsche 991-Point of view???

    991.1 2014 GT3 stil trading around 140k after 3 years .... not bad and far from 120k.

    I see the price stabilizing because of last NA and may be RC is right but why having the touring keeping more value ?

    This car is a joke .... how to sell more cars and please people who were screwed with 911R.

    But fantastic marketing as usual.Porsche is one of the best company regarding branding and special edition. Kudos to them.

    And there is still people buying it. I saw a targa 4 gts in a showroom ... at 178k .... adn the y sell them.


    --

    997 Carrera S Triple Black Sold now ... Good car 997 GT3 triple black wow what a car !!!


    Re: Your Porsche 991-Point of view???

    thierry:

    991.1 2014 GT3 stil trading around 140k after 3 years .... not bad and far from 120k.

    I see the price stabilizing because of last NA and may be RC is right but why having the touring keeping more value ?

    This car is a joke .... how to sell more cars and please people who were screwed with 911R.

    But fantastic marketing as usual.Porsche is one of the best company regarding branding and special edition. Kudos to them.

    And there is still people buying it. I saw a targa 4 gts in a showroom ... at 178k .... adn the y sell them.

     

    In Germany they are cheaper...

    https://m.mobile.de/fahrzeuge/details.html?id=252177143&utm_source=com.apple.UIKit.activity.Mail&utm_medium=ios

    https://m.mobile.de/fahrzeuge/details.html?id=247035021&utm_source=com.apple.UIKit.activity.Mail&utm_medium=ios

    also the first 991.1 GT3 RS was sold for close to 160K €

    Prices are going down and this should be normal for cars...

    Blueflame

     


    Re: Your Porsche 991-Point of view???

    You remember that deal when my dealer offered me a brand-new 991.2 Carrera GTS Cab in exchange for my 991.1 Carrera 4 GTS Cab, same lease rate no down payment and all? Well, my "old" 991.1 Carrera 4 GTS was gone fast, as far as I understood for 135k EUR. Smiley Had 12k km, was almost three years old, MSRP was 163k or so. I think it kept it's value pretty well.


    --

    RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991.2 Carrera GTS Cabriolet (2018), Porsche Cayenne S Diesel (2017), Audi R8 V10 Plus (2016), Mini JCW (2015)


    Re: Your Porsche 991-Point of view???

    RC - I'm seeing 991.1GTS  coupes going for $120K and new 991.2  GTS coupes in the $140K range.  The GTSs seem to be holding their value. 


    --

    2016 Porsche 991 Carrera GTS  Black with AeroKit Cup Package,  2017 Porsche Cayenne Platinum  Purpurite Metallic, New York


    Re: Your Porsche 991-Point of view???

    From today at our OPC...first impression:

    The new seat-material smells totally ugly and is very slipery, at least with jeans.

    I hope to get a test drive in spring...

    BlueflameEF1B09B1-742A-465C-A552-2D3916CD5F0F.jpeg
    9CB013F1-18AD-45EB-AC1D-1E0F14B5A4A8.jpeg
    46624564-64AD-4BD2-AE4A-553328EC6676.jpeg
    49BF6C7D-8C6E-401D-A977-AB7C0AC8400B.jpeg
    DD5BF565-61B9-4BAA-8FA3-6457732CC5E9.jpeg


    Re: Your Porsche 991-Point of view???

    can't believe they put strap on the T and regular door handles on the GT3...enlightened


    --

    GT Lover

    Porsche fan

    991.2 GT3 on order

    991 GT3 2014(sold)

    CAYENNE GTS 2014


    Re: Your Porsche 991-Point of view???

    the-missile:

    can't believe they put strap on the T and regular door handles on the GT3...enlightened

    They have to distinguish the GT3 from the RS this way (among others).


    --

    18 GT3 Manual, 73 Carrera RS 2.7 Carbon Fiber replica (1,890 lbs), 06 EVO9 with track mods. Former: 16 Cayman GT4, 73 911S, Two 951S's, 996 C2, 993 C2, 98 Ferrari 550, 79 635CSi


    Re: Your Porsche 991-Point of view???

    even the little GT4 got the strap...Smiley


    --

    GT Lover

    Porsche fan

    991.2 GT3 on order

    991 GT3 2014(sold)

    CAYENNE GTS 2014


    Re: Your Porsche 991-Point of view???

    Grant:
    the-missile:

    can't believe they put strap on the T and regular door handles on the GT3...enlightened

    They have to distinguish the GT3 from the RS this way (among others).

     

    My take is that the GT3 is a street car that's capable on the track, hence the handle. Different than the GT3RS, which is a track car that's drivable on the street.

    The Carrera T is sort of a nod to the 911R, 'lightweight' car, hence the strap, like in the 911R. 

    The GT4? Another fun project car from AP like the 911R, so strap it is.

     


    --

     

     


    Re: Your Porsche 991-Point of view???

    the-missile:

    even the little GT4 got the strap...Smiley

    That's because there is no GT4 RS with a strap.  That's also why the GT4 has the scaffolding holding the rear wing like the GT3 RS...


    --

    18 GT3 Manual, 73 Carrera RS 2.7 Carbon Fiber replica (1,890 lbs), 06 EVO9 with track mods. Former: 16 Cayman GT4, 73 911S, Two 951S's, 996 C2, 993 C2, 98 Ferrari 550, 79 635CSi


    Re: Your Porsche 991-Point of view???

    The 911 T is certainly a very interesting offer from Porsche but I assume that discounts for this model are not big and you can get an almost new and only slightly used 911 Carrera S or even GTS for basically similar money, so I would be careful with a rush decision. Resale value could be better on this one (911 T) but there is no guarantee.


    --

    RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991.2 Carrera GTS Cabriolet (2018), Porsche Cayenne S Diesel (2017), Audi R8 V10 Plus (2016), Mini JCW (2015)


    Re: Your Porsche 991-Point of view???

    I just had a test drive at our OPC with a base 991.2. Targa4 PDK/PSE to get a impression of the "T"engine in comparison to my 981 Spyder and 964 RS.

    The heavy Targa with 4WD and 5 HP less than my Spyder sounded good and was in my personal opinon a little bit slower than my 981.

    Regarding the 150 KG weight penalty, the standard suspension, Winter tyres and PDK of the base Targa - I would say, that the 991.2 T should be as fast as my Spyder and faster than my good old 964 RS.

    What I didn´t like at all with this base car - the standard brakes - they pedal-feeling was way to soft.

    I would order the T, just with LWB and PCCB - very basic and drive this car for 2 years...my sales man told me today that the T-list price is not rock-solid, so there is room for some €€€.

    Blueflame


    Re: Your Porsche 991-Point of view???

    blueflame:

    I just had a test drive at our OPC with a base 991.2. Targa4 PDK/PSE to get a impression of the "T"engine in comparison to my 981 Spyder and 964 RS.

    The heavy Targa with 4WD and 5 HP less than my Spyder sounded good and was in my personal opinon a little bit slower than my 981.

    Regarding the 150 KG weight penalty, the standard suspension, Winter tyres and PDK of the base Targa - I would say, that the 991.2 T should be as fast as my Spyder and faster than my good old 964 RS.

    What I didn´t like at all with this base car - the standard brakes - they pedal-feeling was way to soft.

    I would order the T, just with LWB and PCCB - very basic and drive this car for 2 years...my sales man told me today that the T-list price is not rock-solid, so there is room for some €€€.

    Blueflame

    Thanks for your impressions! Very valuable!

    The 4-runner always felt heavy compared to the RWD. The typical 911 feel is majorly based on the light front end. The 4WD doesn't have that feeling - a reason why I always preferred the the RWD. 


    Re: Your Porsche 991-Point of view???

    A T with PCCB makes a lot of sense. I like it. Fun car to drive!


    Re: Your Porsche 991-Point of view???

    Leawood911:

    A T with PCCB makes a lot of sense. I like it. Fun car to drive!

    Yep, that is the lightest and least powerful car to ever offer the full-size (410mm) PCCB's - they should last, even on track...


    --

    18 GT3 Manual, 73 Carrera RS 2.7 Carbon Fiber replica (1,890 lbs), 06 EVO9 with track mods. Former: 16 Cayman GT4, 73 911S, Two 951S's, 996 C2, 993 C2, 98 Ferrari 550, 79 635CSi


    Re: Your Porsche 991-Point of view???

    blueflame:

    I´m thinking about buying a manual 991 as a keeper for some years.

    The new 991.2 T is growing on me, but I fear that I don´t like the base brakes. But there is a chance to get one in a PTS-color.

    Also on my list are 991.1 GTS and 992.2 GTS as used cars - the prices for all 3 possibilities are not far away from each other.

    Waiting another 2 years for a used 991.2 GT3 Touring is also an option, but I want a 911 for this summer...

    What would you do?

    Blueflame

    PS I hate fixed wings and PDK, so no 991.1 GT3

    My dealer has this one (only 3700 km) for 89k EUR. Manual, base 991.2 Carrera but with BOSE, Sport Chrono and sport exhaust.

    151666656976920171204102212831_003.jpg

     

    He also has a 991.2 GTS with PDK in "kreide"...only 500 km, 138k EUR. Rear wheel steering, black LED lights, lots of stuff.

    20171030081058548_003.jpg

    Other German dealers may have similar or better deals.


    --

     

    RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991.2 Carrera GTS Cabriolet (2018), Porsche Cayenne S Diesel (2017), Audi R8 V10 Plus (2016), Mini JCW (2015)

     


    Re: Your Porsche 991-Point of view???

    Do you want a 991.2 Carrera 4 instead? Here we go...only 9800 km...98k EUR. PDK, pretty basic options.

    20171204102021637_003.jpg

     

    As you can see, they "throw" them out right now...


    --

    RC (Germany) - Rennteam Editor Porsche 991.2 Carrera GTS Cabriolet (2018), Porsche Cayenne S Diesel (2017), Audi R8 V10 Plus (2016), Mini JCW (2015)


     
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